[Kellie aka Ms. B]

Since so many parasiteware programs feed off of SE listings, I thought I'd put the question to Google. Even though their AdWorks are CPC now, still I was curious as to what they would say. And parasite's could affect your CTR. My email to them:

Original Message Follows:
------------------------
From: xxxx@me.com
Subject: AdWords Select user feedback: Protection of Ad Campaign
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 05:50:21 -0700

User ID: guest
Category: quality
--------------------------
Hello,

I am considering run advertising
campaigns through Google. I have a
question before a final decision is
made. I was curious if Google takes
any steps to protect against the
numerous "contextual marketing"
software programs which seem to
popping up everywhere on the Internet
these days. I am referring to the
types of programs which feed off of
keyword searches at all the search
engines and then pop up some type of
ad or incentive to entice the user to
click on their ad away from the search
engine listings. The two most well
known of these types of programs being
WhenU and Gator.

I have concerns since Google will
still load the page and an impression
would be tallied for my keyword
search, but there are these 3rd party
programs interloping and competing
with my $$ which is intended to be
targeted only to Google. I would
appreciate any feedback you have as to
what steps Google may take to protect
the advertising $$ of your
advertisers. Thank you in advance for
your input.


And their response:


Hello,

Thank you for your email, and we understand your concerns regarding these types of products.

These types of programs run within a users' browsers and are controlled within their computers. To the extent that we are able, we educate our users regarding the dangers of these types of programs. Please visit http://www.google.com/help/nopopupads.html for more information.

We have not had issues regarding these products in the past, and our advertisers enjoy an above average CTR for Internet marketing. Rest assured, you will not be charged even if this behavior occurs. Since you are only charged when your ad is clicked on, you will not pay unless a user clicks on your ad.

Sincerely,
Alana
AdWords Policy Specialist
The Google AdWords Team

If you follow their link in the email, they pretty much bash the programs and even give a link to AdAware.

Keep Your Hands Off My Cookies

[chetf]

There isn't much really they can do. All the current scripts to detect are a little bumpy for them to use, and they are very hands off on their general approach to the end user.

Chet

[CrazyGuy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Rest assured, you will not be charged even if this behavior occurs. Since you are only charged when your ad is clicked on, you will not pay unless a user clicks on your ad.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know there's virtually nothing they can do - but the statement above doesn't really suggest they know what they're dealing with.

Stewart Hutton | Are you Crazy?

[ecomcity]

BLFH has the right idea and planted a seed for us to get the most powerful SE involved in our fight. Those of us who pay into Google for Keyword Ads need to add some more push. They seem to think their advertiser links trigger some Gator type popups but do not know that any Morpheus merchant in any category is feeding off of their Google advertisers text and keywords.

Point them to posts here and the NY Times article where they will grasp that these parasites are monitizing those paid CPC Ads and diluting the value of their advertizing partners. TigerDirect -Mondera -Coldwater Creek -Body & Bath and others sure don't want their google listing and their text Ads cherry picked by Morpheus/Gator/ShopNow etc etc shopping club merchants. If someone clicks on a Tigerdirect trademark paid for keyword Ad these parasites all follow thta shopper to TD site. They then present a slew of shopping bars -Popup coupons -rewards alerts to entice the shopper to a competitor like Dell or Micro Warehouse to load their affiliate cookie.

Merchants should also complain to Overture for the same activity. Anyone bidding and paying for advertising on these CPC search engines either get double dipped on purchases, if they're a parasite merchant( cost of click plus commission) or the parasites and Dupers record the click activity and follow the shopper to do their dasterly deeds.

I'm surprised that all the SE's haven't shut down these interlopers. Of course Looksmart just feeds their listings to their pool of parasites so never advertise there.

WebMaster Mike

[Kellie aka Ms. B]

@Chet: True, but at least that don't completely ignore it or worse yet condone it. And they do provide some good information regarding it.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> CrazyGuy said:
I know there's virtually nothing they can do - but the statement above doesn't really suggest they know what they're dealing with.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think they know exactly what they are dealing with. That is quite evident if you look at the link they also sent in the email. That line you quoted is nothing but business spin. I personally filter out business spin. And there is truth to their statement. You don't have to pay unless someone clicks on your link. And I wouldn't be surprised if the parasite issue was one of the reasons of them moving from a CPM to a CPC model.

My favorite part from their site:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> If you feel you were deceived when you installed a program that creates pop-ups, you may want to take action. The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) handles complaints about deceptive or unfair business practices. To file a complaint, visit: http://www.ftc.gov/ and click on "File a Complaint Online", call 1-877-FTC-HELP, or write to:

Federal Trade Commission
CRC-240
Washington, D.C. 20580

If your complaint is against a company in another country, please file it at http://www.econsumer.gov/.

We wish you luck in your quest to quell pop-ups. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

@Mike: Yes SE are just another feeding ground for parasites that keep them alive, which is why I got curious about what Google would say. They really don't effect the affiliate's AdWorks listings except to dilute their CTR, and I have seen some posts by people saying their listings were suspended due to low CTR. I do think it's a very valid point for merchants to bring up to Google though. Especially merchants who are running "Premium Sponsorships" with a $15,000 minimum buy. Even folks like Michael at BareNeccessities who don't allow any parasites into his programs, may very well be getting slammed the likes of Gator and WhenU.

I think Google should be applauded for the stance.

Keep Your Hands Off My Cookies

[yintercept]

I don't think the message really conveyed the problem of double dipping. Google needs to know from a merchant the problems of the parasites. That is, a merchant will pay google for a click. However, the parasite injects itself after the click to claim commissions on the sales from the click.

From the merchant's perspective, they will see a worthless Google campaign that did not generate any revenue...and they will see a parasite that is generating revenue. The merchant then cancels the Google Ad...causing sadness among the Googlians.

The thing Google needs to know is that the parasites mean less money for google. They directly affect the pocket books of the employees and investors at Google.

Google doesn't need to know just about the informed merchants. They need to know that they lose money from both the informed and uninformed merchant. If 40% of computers are infected with parasites, then Google will lose about 10% of their ad revenue!

Protophoto - Short Stories

[TerriFalcone]

If Google does not take a more active role in defeating these suckers then they may find people gradually or perhaps not so gradually finding other search engines more desirable. When I use Firefox I use Scroogle Scraper for my search engine even though it is ugly as sin simply to rid myself of the parasites. If Scroogle can do it then Google can do it.
http://www.scroogle.org/cgi-bin/scraper.htm

[Adam Ward]

this is a 2002 thread

[TerriFalcone]

How sad. That means there have been problems since 2002 !

[chetf]

Originally Posted by TerriFalcone

If Google does not take a more active role in defeating these suckers then they may find people gradually or perhaps not so gradually finding other search engines more desirable. When I use Firefox I use Scroogle Scraper for my search engine even though it is ugly as sin simply to rid myself of the parasites. If Scroogle can do it then Google can do it.
http://www.scroogle.org/cgi-bin/scraper.htm

Thanks for the warning to avoid your program.

Chet