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  1. #1
    Plain Ol' Affiliate Rainmaker's Avatar
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    Checks Unlimited Boots its NY Affiliates
    The email (below) sent out AFTER the day has ended, on a Friday no less. Thanks for the notice guys!! Jeeezzz.
    Nice way to treat your affiliates. I would have thought that ARC could have given us some sort of heads up. This sucks!!

    Fri, May 30, 2008 at 7:30 PM

    The new affiliate legislation relating to sales tax in the State of New York has forced us to re-evaluate our relationships with our New York affiliates and, unfortunately, requires us to discontinue our affiliate program in New York State effective today, May 30, 2008.

    After evaluating the options, we felt this was the only option that could be practicably implemented by June 1st. We have always appreciated our relationship with you and your business. Please know that our decision to end this relationship has not been an easy one.

    Sincerely,
    Tracey Engelhardt
    ChecksUnlimited.com & DesignerChecks.com


    P.S. - Please feel free to contact our affiliate program manager, Andy Rodriguez with any questions or for further information at
    andy@andyrodriguez.com or by phone at 305-412-3512.


  2. #2
    Affiliate Marketing Consultant Andy Rodriguez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainmaker
    The email (below) sent out AFTER the day has ended, on a Friday no less. Thanks for the notice guys!! Jeeezzz.
    Nice way to treat your affiliates. I would have thought that ARC could have given us some sort of heads up. This sucks!!


    Bob,

    I feel your pain man, it sucks for everyone..

    There was a heads up as soon as I got the final word, i posted it here:
    http://forum.abestweb.com/showpost.p...7&postcount=38

    Sorry for the timing of the news but we were all trying to find a solution until the last minute. We were in conference calls with their corporate, legal and tax department most of the week until the last hour on Friday.

    We didn't want to jump the gun and make an announcement we would later have to contradict, we wanted to wait till legal made the decision.

    As a note, knowing many of you are PPC affiliates, the deactivation will not go through untill midnight tonight so all of you have time to remove your PPC campaigns. I didn't pull the plug when the email went out ... none of you have received the sas deactivation notice, you will get it tonight. You all have time if you read the email from yesterday ....

    Nobody wins here Bob ... trust me.
    Andy Rodriguez Consulting, Affiliate Program Management and Consulting Services, Since 2001
    www.andyrodriguez.com | E: abw@andyrodriguez.com | P: (888) 931-ANDY (2639) | Skype: affiliatedoctor | AIM & MSN: AffiliateDoctor | Subscribe To Our ABW Forum Posts | Follow me on Twitter | Join Our Affiliate Programs

  3. #3
    Plain Ol' Affiliate Rainmaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Rodriguez
    We didn't want to jump the gun and make an announcement we would later have to contradict, we wanted to wait till legal made the decision.
    ....I hear ya on that.
    It would have eased the shock if they had said that we had till the end of the day today to pull our campaigns and links. (even though it's still pretty bad forcing us to jump like this on a weekend, and with such short notice).

    I made sales today for CU... will I get paid?
    Will affiliates get paid for sales that come in over the next 180 days?

  4. #4
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    Can't confirm, but I believe your cookies crumble today.
    Kevin Webster
    twitter: levelanalytics

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  5. #5
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainmaker
    Will affiliates get paid for sales that come in over the next 180 days?
    I think that is a very interesting question.

    Assuming that merchants can avoid the tax by dropping NY affiliates before June 1, if they were to pay even one commission for a sale after June 1, due to a cookie set from before June 1, it seems they would be subject to collecting the tax for all NY sales (assuming they met the $10,000.00 threshold).

    In fact, as I think more about it, they could not avoid the tax cosequences even if they did not pay the commission. Making the sale referred through the affiliate by virtue of the cookie set before June 1 is probably enough.

    Kevin, as I mull this I saw your comment. The cookie crumbled means no commission, but the sale referred by the affiliate would still push the merchant into having to collect the tax. What do you think - doesn't this lay to waste the prevailing theory so many merchants believe that they can avoid the tax by dumping their NY affiliates?

    In fact, if a merchant voids affiliate cookies in an attempt to avoid having to collect the tax, and does not collect and pay over to the state the tax on sales that were referrred by NY affiliates, is that not tax evasion?
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
    "If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?" -John Wooden;
    "Raj, there’s no place for truth on the internet." -Howard Wolowitz[/SIZE]

  6. #6
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    AH: That's going to be determined by whether or not the merchant met the nexus condition over the last 4 tax quarters. If they have, dumping us now is, well, pointless.

    They still have to register (or HAD to prior to June 1st I guess).

    A lot of these merchants aren't so bright, unless they can definitively state they didn't meet the condition these last 4 tax quarters. I talked to one yesterday that were positive they hadn't.

    As far as the cookie goes, if Bob isn't in the program in 120 days when a cookied sale occurs, then they don't pay a commission, and therefore aren't moving towards nexus going forward.

    And here I thought I was taking a week off.
    Kevin Webster
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  7. #7
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Everything I said assumes the $10,000 threshold was met in the prior 4 quarters. (inapplicable to merchant who did not meet it)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin
    As far as the cookie goes, if Bob isn't in the program in 120 days when a cookied sale occurs, then they don't pay a commission, and therefore aren't moving towards nexus going forward.
    Not in program = don't have to pay commission. But - the fact is the customer was referred by the NY affiliate is the nexus. Seems that it would be illegal to attempt to avoid the nexus and collecting the tax by dropping the affiliate after the actual customer referral was made. The sale after June 1 produced by an affiliate referral would seem to still subject the merchant to collecting the tax (again, assuming the threshold was met).
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
    "If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?" -John Wooden;
    "Raj, there’s no place for truth on the internet." -Howard Wolowitz[/SIZE]

  8. #8
    ABW Ambassador Boom or Bust's Avatar
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    Don't forget about the other criteria such as whether or not there was promotion directly to NY residents outside of website links etc. What a sticky wicket!



    X

  9. #9
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    Don't forget about the other criteria such as whether or not there was promotion outside of website links etc.
    That one isn't in concrete yet Very much an interpretation issue. It's my favorite reading of the law though ;p

    Not in program = don't have to pay commission. But - the fact is the customer was referred by the NY affiliate is the nexus. Seems that it would be illegal to attempt to avoid the nexus and collecting the tax by dropping the affiliate after the actual customer referral was made. The sale after June 1 produced by an affiliate referral would seem to still subject the merchant to collecting the tax (again, assuming the threshold was met).
    Ok, I see where you're going. And I hate where you're going For states that might have this legislation pending in the future, it's a great argument in favor of the 1/2 hour cookie, eh?
    Kevin Webster
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  10. #10
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin
    For states that might have this legislation pending in the future, it's a great argument in favor of the 1/2 hour cookie, eh?
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
    "If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?" -John Wooden;
    "Raj, there’s no place for truth on the internet." -Howard Wolowitz[/SIZE]

  11. #11
    Affiliate Marketing Consultant Andy Rodriguez's Avatar
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    Bob,

    Sales made today will get credited, no worries. We must deactivate the NY affiliate accounts tonight - if SAS reports sales from you or any other affiliate withing the 180 days to us, will will gladly pay the commish unless our legal team says otherwise.... good question for our Monday phone conference.

    We have no issues in paying out commissions, none. We pay close to $200K in monthly commssions to affiliates on this program ....
    Andy Rodriguez Consulting, Affiliate Program Management and Consulting Services, Since 2001
    www.andyrodriguez.com | E: abw@andyrodriguez.com | P: (888) 931-ANDY (2639) | Skype: affiliatedoctor | AIM & MSN: AffiliateDoctor | Subscribe To Our ABW Forum Posts | Follow me on Twitter | Join Our Affiliate Programs

  12. #12
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    No one questions CU's ability to pay Andy, or even their desire. If the cookie discussion continues, I'll split it out, since it can't be pinned on CU alone.
    Kevin Webster
    twitter: levelanalytics

    Kayak Fishing
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