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  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador JJJay's Avatar
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    I thought the following might interest you.

    http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0...850778,00.html

    A witch has won subsidies from the Norwegian state to run a business of selling potions, fortune-telling and magic.

    Lena Skarning, 33, won the unprecedented start-up grant of 53,000 crowns (£4,400) after promising not to try out harmful spells with her business, Forest Witch Magic Consulting.

    Ms Skarning owns a white cat and says she has been practising witchcraft for 13 years.

    She claims the runaway success of JK Rowling's Harry Potter books about a boy wizard may have made society more tolerant of sorcery.

    "But Harry Potter is a fairy tale and I'm not," she said. "I'm the real thing. And now I'm Norway's only state-backed witch."

    She said the government subsidy would help her tell fortunes from Tarot cards, teach magic tricks at corporate seminars.

    The witch will also be developing products like magical bath oil, water potions or face creams meant to help users have clearer dreams at night.

    "The ingredients are mostly herbs - nothing scary," she said of her products.

  2. #2
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    [IMAGE REMOVED]

    [This message was edited by Haiko on October 22, 2003 at 07:25 PM.]

  3. #3
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Cute

    But, seriously, would you find this strange or funny if a Christian or Jewish business had gotten a grant?

    Or, how about if there was a sale on prayers for bad things to happen? Witches as a whole DO NOT sale evil spells or curses. I am sure that some do, but witches are about as likely to do that as a Christian is to pray for something evil to befall someone. And, just as errant when they do because we have other ways of dealing with those who have done evil against us that don't have the negative karmic repercussions of a curse.

    I mention this because I really don't like to see these erroneous stereotypes perpetuated even in fun. I am sure no offense was intended and none taken. But, let me ask, what would your response have been if I had posted a picture of a ********* and made some silly remark about *********? Humm? Would you have been amused? If you feel that would be offensive, why do you feel it is less offensive when it is my religion? Please, explain that to me so I will understand why you think it is OK to belittle my religion and make fun of the people who follow my faith.

    Well, I guess the point is that that there has been some progress in religious tolerance, somewhere in this world, which of course, is a very good thing all around.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

    [removed slur]

    [This message was edited by Haiko on October 22, 2003 at 10:25 PM.]

  4. #4
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    Ssanf:

    Interesting points. There are two aspects to consider - the state backing a religious enterprise, and the idea of "selling" spells/prayers. Both are a bit repugnant to me. I don't think the state (government) should be in the business of directly funding a for-profit religious enterprise. Two, I'd have a tough time explaining to my Sunday School class that soliciting negative prayer requests for profit fits into general Christian ethics. I accept prayer requests "pro bono" although I'd shy away at those seeking a something hurtful to someone.

    Karl Smith
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  5. #5
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I accept prayer requests "pro bono" although I'd shy away at those seeking a something hurtful to someone. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Exactly! So do we.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  6. #6
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    The state is not "backing a religious enterprise" as such, as this is not really a religious business just because she is a witch.
    She's not going to sell spells and prayers.

    This idea is far from the worst business I've heard SND fund over the years.

    I know one personally that got funding to extract pure pine perfume oil from the pine trees. He's successfull on the international perfume oil market now, with several unique perfume oils. But it took him almost 10 years after the initial funding.

    Anyhow, the funder, the State's Business and District Development Fund (SND), is well known for giving startup help to all kinds of strange and original business ideas.

    And especially when they come from women that live far away from the cities.

    SND's former name was the District Development Fund. With the name change they were given more money, and was supposed to also consider more urban business ideas. This hasn't really happened, it's business as usual. Sometimes it seems like the most important thing about the business idea is that it takes place out in the districts.

    The fund has a lot of money to spend on business startups. So if you want some, come to Norway, move out of the city and start knitting or something.

    Along with the funding, you'll get Big Brother looking over your shoulder all the time. They want reports on how business is every three months, and are likely to change the funding into a loan if they don't like what you do with the cash.

    [This message was edited by Smallshop on October 22, 2003 at 04:20 PM.]

  7. #7
    ABW Ambassador DesignerWiz's Avatar
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    LMFAO MIKE!!!!
    Sorry SSanf!

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    ABW Board: Category: Programming / Coding

  8. #8
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    DesignerWiz.com please explain why you find gross mischaractization of the physical attributes of a religious group and slanderous misrepresentation of the beliefs and practices of the majority of that group funny.


    "Sorry SSanf!" Only tells me that you know it is wrong. So, why do you encourage it?

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  9. #9
    ABW Ambassador JJJay's Avatar
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    I hate to correct people but "mischaractization" should be "mischaracterization". SSanf you really should use a "spell checker"

  10. #10
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    "Posts containing racist, sexual- or religious-, personal-, etc offending content will be removed and will get you banned immediately."

    Ssanf feels this is offending her religion so it should be removed. Remember, it might not be offending to you because it is not your religion so you wouldn't experience the same feelings of someone whose religion it is.

    "The successful man is the average man, focused."

  11. #11
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Thank you for your understanding.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  12. #12
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SSanf:
    Cute

    But, let me ask, what would your response have been if I had posted a picture of a ******** and made some silly remark about ************? Humm? Would you have been amused? If you feel that would be offensive, why do you feel it is less offensive when it is my religion? Please, explain that to me so I will understand why you think it is OK to belittle my religion and make fun of the people who follow my faith.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I tend to agree but at the same time it was cute.

    I will never forget how when I was a young girl I went to another church and afterwards heard a man telling a joke about my religon. We were all of the Christian faith, just a different denomination.

    I also feel that sometimes people can be overly sensitive. Do you remember the Mel Brooks movies? He makes fun of everything, including his own religion. I think his message was to acknowledge that we all all just human and not to take things so seriously.

    Ebudae

    If you understand, things are just as they are...
    if you do not understand, things are just as they are.

    [edited quoted portion - see above]

    [This message was edited by Haiko on October 22, 2003 at 10:26 PM.]

  13. #13
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Well, I heard a lot of "black" jokes when I was growing up, too. They had an element of humor, I suppose. Did that make it OK? Do you think we should keep telling them and just tell blacks not to be so sensitive, not to take things so seriously?

    Anybody want to hear a "black" joke? Or, do you suppose that just might get me banned? (I'm not asking that anyone be banned.)

    Why are black babies.....Uh huh, are you sure you want THAT kind of thing on ABW? I don't. I am just asking for the posts to be removed. Seems reasonable to me.
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> but at the same time it was cute. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    It is NOT cute! It is insulting and degrading.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

    [This message was edited by SSanf on October 22, 2003 at 06:00 PM.]

  14. #14
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
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    SSanf,

    I've just come back on line, please allow me to investigate.

    TY to the mod who moved or removed the post!

    Anyone please feel free to PM or email me your thoughts or concerns in this matter.

    <font size="2" face="Verdana">Haiko


    The secret of success is constancy of purpose. ~ Disraeli
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  15. #15
    ABW Ambassador Radegast's Avatar
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    SSanf

    I have a lot of respect for you.

    You have a good sense of humour, but on this one topic you are completely inflexible, and it's too easy for people to wind you up when they want to cause mischief.

    As an Englishman, I think the ability to laugh at yourself is not to be underestimated.

    I also think that non-P.C. jokes are a healthy way for most people to handle topics that they might otherwise be uncomfortable around, and there are consequences to stopping them making such jokes. We have a deep, instinctive, tribal fear of anything that is 'different', and jokes are a relatively harmless way of dealing with that. In the long term, hopefully, more people will have the benefit of education and there will be more tolerance of different cultures/religions, but, in the meantime, jokes are a useful safety valve, and it is dangerous to suppress them.

  16. #16
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    PM sent

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  17. #17
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Uh huh. Well, I could make it really good here and make lot's of real healthy non-P.C. jokes that are racist, sexual- or religious-, personal-, etc containing offending content.

    But, I don't think you would find the board all that improved. Personally, I recommend other saftey valves to be free from the dangers of surpressing those needs.


    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> We have a deep, instinctive, tribal fear of anything that is 'different', and jokes are a relatively harmless way of dealing with that. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Harmless to who? Told a lot of racist jokes right out in public lately? Why not?

    P.S. I have a lot of respect for you, too.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  18. #18
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    You know, I started out trying to be tolerant of this. But, the more I think about it the madder and more upset I get.

    I am going to have to not respond to this thread any more because I am just too angry.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!

    Farewell, CJ! I loved you when you were young and pure. I will try to remember you that way. Disclaimer: Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  19. #19
    ABW Ambassador Radegast's Avatar
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by SSanf:
    Harmless to who? Told a lot of racist jokes right out in public lately? Why not?

    P.S. I have a lot of respect for you, too.
    [QUOTE]
    Not in public, no...that's partly my point. Making people afraid of prosecution adds, to the problem. Also, making 'racist' jokes doesn't make you a racist, necessarily.
    (I know there are people who are bigoted, racist, or just plain evil, but making jokes doesn't qualify you for that)
    I also realise that you probably overstate your case because there is such widespread ignorance and fear about your crede.
    Maybe I'd better leave it there before I shoot myself in the second foot...

    Thanks for the respect

  20. #20
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    SSanf,

    I will have to agree with you concerning some jokes are simply without taste, but when and where do we draw the line.

    Personally I am so sick at the over sensitive nature of society as a whole. Free speech has now turned into Free speech only if you do not offend someone.

    The other day I received a letter from a catholic complaining that within my ecard section she found the flatulent jokes offensive and the image of a nun utilizing her computer while sticking here tongue out (you know concentrating hard) offensive. As a catholic she did not appreciate it at all.

    I wanted to write back and tell her where the off button on her computer was, instead decided to explain I went to catholic school during my young life and that picture was sent to me by that nun, someone took that picture of her and she thought it was hilarious. I asked her if I could use it in my ecards section and she said sure.

    WHY did I have to tell her anything?
    WHY are people so darned sensitive?
    Are Farts offensive now?

    You have been on this board since August 24, 2001 and have viewed numerous Ecomcity posts…. Most of the time he does not intend to offend it just happens; when he is chastised he apologizes.

    Personally I think you have gone way over board with your complaint.


  21. #21
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
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    I've removed the image.

    While some may say "Hey, it's only a "cute" cartoon!" I think we all must realize that a harmless joke or cartoon, may in fact be demeaning and/or hurtful to the group, stereotype or person that may be the subject of such.

    My action on this issue is to simply request that we all try to have "more" compassion and understanding of our fellow member's religion, race or creed ... we are a family!

    Family tiffs happen. Now lets all move forward and grow ... richer! As Ssanf says ... "Blessed be" ... one and all.

    <font size="2" face="Verdana">Haiko


    The secret of success is constancy of purpose. ~ Disraeli
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  22. #22
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    "WHY did I have to tell her anything?
    WHY are people so darned sensitive?
    Are Farts offensive now?"

    Exactly, I'm a blonde. My dad and LOT of other people send me blonde jokes. I really don't find them funny but I don't let them bother me either.

    Yesterday I attended a "Code of Conduct" training. Everyone in my entire company has to attend it. It included the "Sexual Harassment" training. We watched a video.

    There was nothing in this training video that I would consider sexual harassment. That really bothered me. We are telling people to complain and get people fired because they won't open their mouth and say "your behavior is inappropriate, please stop."

    Give me a break!

    SJohnson@NO_Spam_ClickMagazine.Net
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  23. #23
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Just login to ABW and sure don't know what the flap was about. I posted a image of a Holloween characture witch and black grinning cat with a simple sign hawking spells 2 for 5.00. What's up with that as Disney Shop -Pets.com -Hallmark -MTV and thousands of others have copied that Holloween promo for use on their web sites since I first put it up in 1999. I put it up on my site every year like I do Thanksgiving and Christmas silly characters to humor shoppers and get them to go to holiday themed gifting merchants.

    It certainly never was posted with a moments thought at ever being offensive to anyone including the PC police. Out of respect for SSanf I would like to donate the image as evidence in a class action suit brought by the ACLU against the whole retail industry and people who celebrate that off color Holiday called Holloween. I removed it and the merchant links to Holloween costumes and decorations from my front page too.

    Mike & Charlie ...

    If they won't adopt and feed a bird ..flip them one! BBQ some Gator and remember to flush WhenU..

  24. #24
    pph Expert! Gordon's Avatar
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    I'm sorry but I think you are a bit over the top Ssanf. I personaly can laugh at any joke.

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    [This message was edited by Gordon on October 22, 2003 at 08:43 PM.]

  25. #25
    ABW Ambassador Andy's Avatar
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    I believe we have to consider whether or not there was malicious intent on the part of the poster. In this case, I don't believe Mike intended to offend anyone by his post.

    Still, we must be careful because people do see things differently, and what doesn't bother one will bother another. I understand that Sandra was offended by the picture, but I don't believe that was its intent.

    When you're human, it's hard to be perfect all the time...

    ...so what's Charlie's excuse?

    Andy

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