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  1. #1
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    I've noticed a few merchants with affiliate programs have affiliate links for other programs on their websites, do you find this acceptable?

    For the record, I don't.

  2. #2
    notary sojac Herb ԿԬ's Avatar
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    There'll always be some. But I do consider them as competing with the rest of us. And it doesn't say much about their product or service that they must sell something else also.

  3. #3
    ABW Ambassador Vrindavan's Avatar
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    should not on the refer url landing page

  4. #4
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    I have seen several of those too and I stay away from them. Are they a merchant or an affiliate?

    If they have to promote other affiliate programs to make money, their stuff is worthless in my opinion.

    To answer the question, no I don't find this acceptable.

    Catwoman

  5. #5
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    Catwoman, ? for you. Do you consider Amazon.com affiliate program to be a Merchant or an Affiliate.

    None of the book I've bought from Amazon was worthless in my opinion.

    Explain acceptable if you are a Merchant who also promotes other affiliate programs on their website, like Amazon does. I've used a couple of them as well as Amazon.

    I'm sorry, my wacky day is really wacky today!

  6. #6
    Outsourced Program Manager Jorge - SHOPiMAR's Avatar
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    SammyT

    > I've noticed a few merchants with affiliate programs have affiliate links for other programs on their websites, do you find this acceptable?

    I agree and there should not be any other programs on sites where you are helping affiliates like Amazon, eBay and other big shots out there do already and we still promote because they say they are just a merchant but never and affilaite too.

    I'm not sure if you are talking about our site pricester. Perhaps you went there and saw some small banners on the right hand side that go to another network even though we are now officialy with shareasale. Well, originally back in December we joined the other network cj so that we can see how the banners and links woould work, but after much review and the good reputation from SAS we decided to go with SAS and not post any more banners from cj.

    We were also testing how the size of the banners for our own Website Store would fit into this area since we also have our own inhouse affiliate tracking were the commission is based on lif-time residual.

    Another reason we have these small 88x31 banners on this site is that are planning to promote the stores within our own site as featured stores and just placed this there meantime to test the click throughs etc.

    When we officialy joined SAS a few weeks ago I suggested we now replace these cj banners with our own store featured banners but the delay has been in the banners we ordered to replace them.

    Perhaps you were not refering to our site and even though I could have stayed quite and hope you are talking about somebody else I feel just as strongly about this too and have nothing to fear, hide and was already aware of this.

    Anyone can visit any of our sites at any time and if you notice anything wrong or dis-approve you are welcome to make a public notice any time and specially to let me know direct to my email.

    Put me to the test:

    This is our main site www.pricester.com where we have these small 88x33 banners only on on the "home" page but I quarrantee they will be replaced soon.

    This other site, www.garage-sales-online.com which I have been promoting on my sig should not have anything wrong that will compete with any affiliate.

    Any one can publically blast me here for every day that goes by starting today that this is not taken care of on our part.

    Acceptable Merchant,

    Jorge Ramirez
    Director of Online Marketing
    pricester.com
    jramirez@pricester.com

  7. #7
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    I'm not 100% sure how Amazon really works, but aren't they just a "warehouse" of merchants? They have no products of their own, they sell other merchant's stuff? That's my understanding of Amazon, I could be wrong. Kinda like CatalogCity, aren't they?

    If someone follows one of your Amazon affiliate links and buys something there, you get paid right? Or do they also have affiliate links where you DON'T get paid? I really don't know.

    What I am against is a merchant with affiliate links of his own, promoting other merchants in plain view, where if one of YOUR customers ended up there and bought something through the merchant's affiliate URL, YOU get nothing, but the merchant gets paid.

    I remember one site I looked at and affiliate links were more prominent than their own products. I chuckled and moved on. I did come across a few like that. Maybe some are affiliates who became merchants and need to do this to cover the bills when just starting up? That could be one reason I suppose. I still wouldn't join.

    Catwoman

  8. #8
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> I'm not sure if you are talking about our site pricester. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    No, I've never been to the pricester website, I wasn't refering to you.

    I was actually thinking of Kegworks, they have both allposters posters and amazon books listed on their website. It's what's putting me off joining their program - they are presented on the site along with the range of actual products they sell.

    I mentioned this in Chris's forum and the response can be found on this page:
    http://abw.infopop.cc/eve/ubb.x?q=Y&...3566014674&p=2

  9. #9
    http and a telephoto
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    I was looking at poster merchants and found a very nice site, BUT they have a HUGE allposters section!!!!! Not signing up to send them sales and losing them to their allposters account!!!! They don't have just a link, but the entire allposters catalog integrated into their site.

    Not sure why anyone would sign up to be their affiliate....
    Deborah Carney
    TeamLoxly.com BookGoodies.com ABCsPlus.com

  10. #10
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I'm not 100% sure how Amazon really works, but aren't they just a "warehouse" of merchants? They have no products of their own, they sell other merchant's stuff? That's my understanding of Amazon, I could be wrong. Kinda like CatalogCity, aren't they? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Amazon operate massive distribution facilities for their products (there's one a few miles from me) so they really do ship stuff. However, they also have "marketplace" products which are shipped by third parties, which is a little like the Catalog City model.

    Amazon's commission structure can be a bit arcane, but basically you earn 4%ish on Amazon products and 2.5%ish on Marketplace products, so if somebody visits in that session and buys something, then you'll get credit, so it's not so bad.

    However, there used to be a retailer called Alphacraze on CJ that was trying to compete with Amazon - but due to whatever problems they were having with real inventory, it ended up as a giant affiliate site itself, but without the likes of us actually earning any money from it.

    Catalog City is another case entirely - I rather like them, because they join all the fiddly little programmes so you don't have to and aggregate it for you. They always pay up on time too. But they're not really affiliate links as such.

    BUT.. I gotta say, that if I see affiliate links on a merchant site then I'm going to assume they're just another Alphacraze and generally wouldn't touch them with a bargegpole.
    Innovative advertising with Slimeware Corporation and Telephore. Mail-order fuel with Petrol Direct.

  11. #11
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
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    I work with an indy that has a few affiliate links on the site. They convert, but I wonder if they'd convert better without those uncommissionable links.

    I don't like to see third party affiliate links on a merchant site. It looks 'dinky' and unprofessional and potentially subverts a sale.

    As for Amazon...I hardly bother anymore.

    Interesting question, Samy, thanks for bringing it up.

  12. #12
    ABW Ambassador Andy's Avatar
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    I generally stay away from merchants who promote other merchants, especially if the merchants they promote have affiliate programs. I've made a few exceptions, but by and large ads for other merchants on a merchant site is enough to keep me away.

    I wonder why they are doing this. Do they not believe in their own product mix, and their ability to sell it?

    Why are they encouraging visitors to their site to go elsewhere?

    Some sites link to "sister" sites, owned by the same company, which is OK I suppose, but usually when visitors pass to one of the other sites, your commission cookie becomes null and void. Why give away free traffic to a merchant who tries to cut you out of the deal at every turn?

    Andy

  13. #13
    Outsourced Program Manager Jorge - SHOPiMAR's Avatar
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    Thanks SammyT

    from that forum &gt; little revenue through this channel, nor do we spend any time trying to maximize these programs

    I think it's not a good idea on their part, should no be combined.

    The last post from loxly this morming says it correctly.

  14. #14
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    I don't think it's so awful, as long as the person has a formidable business plan and is not worried about cannibalizing sales. As far as that merchant's affiliates are concerned, you have the choice to not advertise that person. It's just that simple.

  15. #15
    ABW Ambassador Paul_Ward's Avatar
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by Dynamoo:
    [QUOTE]
    Amazon operate massive distribution facilities for their products (there's one a few miles from me)QUOTE]

    Does this mean you live near Bedford? I drive past that warehouse occasionally.

  16. #16
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    I also live about 30 miles from one of their distribution centers in Nevada.

    They started out as a book store selling books from a person's garage, grew to major distribution center via the internet only. They kind of revolutionized the internet ecommerce business. They also offer an Associate program. About 2 years ago they started turning more into a all products distribution site not just books. Those Merchant partners also offer Affiliate programs with their products, such as Target Superstores. Then it continues...

    So is Amazon a Merchant or an Affiliate?

    Both and what's wrong with it. I used affiliates to provide operating cost for my own product sales distribution on my own Merchant website. Traffic improved and so did both sales.

    So why is this unacceptable?

  17. #17
    http and a telephoto
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    They may not pay *much*, but Amazon pays for the sales that come from my clicks that go to the subsidaries on their site....

    We are talking about sites that have affiliate links of their own up without compensating the affiliate sending the traffic that could trickle through that link and produce a sale.

    If I am selling a merchant product and there are books and posters that are appropriate to that merchant, the appropriate links *will* be on my site and I want them to purchase through my links. I don't want to send the traffic to the merchant and lose the commission and the customer to the merchant's allposters link. This would mean I should be getting PPC for traffic I am sending them, since it is uncommissionable.

    If the merchant thinks there are specific books and posters they should be offering their customers they should add them to their product line and sell them through their shoppping cart so that the affiliate gets commission. Period.
    Deborah Carney
    TeamLoxly.com BookGoodies.com ABCsPlus.com

  18. #18
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    What about Ad Sense? It isn't really an affiliate link per se but it is leakage. If a merchant just has ad sense on their site how do you feel about the merchant?

  19. #19
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Paul Ward: Does this mean you live near Bedford? I drive past that warehouse occasionally. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    *In* Bedford actually. The Amazon warehouse is about 10 minutes drive away from where I work. The frustrating thing is it takes three days for my orders to arrive!

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>wackywoman: They started out as a book store selling books from a person's garage, grew to major distribution center via the internet only. They kind of revolutionized the internet ecommerce business. They also offer an Associate program. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    My very first affiliate sales came from Amazon. I've been a member of that program since about 1998 I think. But I guess they've only really improved their program in the past year or so enough for me to get interested enough to make some money. Still, it beats eBay at the moment.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Kip: What about Ad Sense? It isn't really an affiliate link per se but it is leakage. If a merchant just has ad sense on their site how do you feel about the merchant? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    It's the same thing. A merchant site should just sell the merchant's products. "Cross-commerce" is OK if you *don't* have an affiliate program, but otherwise it's just a turn-off.
    Innovative advertising with Slimeware Corporation and Telephore. Mail-order fuel with Petrol Direct.

  20. #20
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    When I become a merchant, the site that affiliates will send traffic too will NOT have adsense or other affiliate program links on it. Period.
    Deborah Carney
    TeamLoxly.com BookGoodies.com ABCsPlus.com

  21. #21
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    In short, if a merchant has affiliate links, they are trying to make other revenue off money from their inbound affiliates. Does not seem quite right to me. If they are a pure online merchant, they would focus on selling their stuff, not someone elses.

  22. #22
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    I started out with my own Merchant website, offering one product, like the gururs back then told you to do. Found it very hard and expensive to market. To keep in business, I went to affiliate/associate programs for link resources around my one product. My affiliate/Associate links made more than my one product sales. But my one product opened up many other avenues..remember I'm doing business on a supper information highway, with all kinds of directions and signs and ways to go.

    So in my opinion Affiliate/Assoicate programs work well together on the web.

    Let's see if I can put it another way. Networking is a word that has many meanings. My network of affilate, associates, merchants, clients, and customers are what are important to my success..

    The Internet is a network, linking all kinds of things together for the public to see. I'm in a lane on the network.

  23. #23
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    wackywoman,

    Not sure why you do not understand why affiliates do not want to represent merchants that maintain affiliate links on there site, but I DO NOT appreciate merchants making money from my traffic that does not directly benefit me the affiliate.

    When you gain by diverting traffic that was sent to you as part of a pay for performance network (lead, sale, etc) you are in a sense STEALING from your own affiliates.

    Example:

    Product: Pinto Beans

    Your Merchant Program: Sells Pinto Beans and maintains an affiliate program to have others sell your Pinto Beans.

    Affiliate site: Maintains numerous store links to Pinto Beans.

    Scenario: An affiliate sends a visitor to your store to buy Pinto Beans, the visitor looks around and what you maintain are not the pinto beans he was looking for. The customer then notices a link to MexiFood (affiliate program link) clicks your link and BUYS the MexiFood Pinto Beans giving you credit for the sale.


    You have just STOLEN from your own affiliate, that lead was intended for YOUR STORE and your store only.


    GET IT NOW?

  24. #24
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    Your example is one way to look at it.

    Yes the customer who followed the link to the affiliate site, found something there other than what you sent him to find. Her purchased from another affiliate program making dollars for the Merchant, which you partnered with...they provided you with the information to get that customer to click.

    You persay didn't make a commission, but you have a customer that originated at your site, providing your visitor value information. He might come back to you again.

    The affiliate link acted as a content link for you and you got traffic.

    So what I didn't make a commission, but it gave me content to get a visitor. Pay per click went out years ago...

    Now I have a valued Merchant that people will click on a link to. I'd keep them and work more with them.

    It all kind of depends on how you use your affiliate programs in your content is the way I look at it and that I don't infringe on the AA.

    That's my opinion and how I understand affiliate marketing.

  25. #25
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    WOW wackywoman,

    I am going to refrain from starting a flame with you as you have a right to your opinion.

    What I will say is; any affiliate not watching out for a merchant like wackywoman will end up with a situation similar to a PARSITE or TIGER DIRECT!

    BAD BUSINESS

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