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  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    [Split] CJ, LinkShare, GAN and PJN Involvement on ABW?
    Moderator Note: Split from thread on LinkShare forum.

    I dought the network network cares (as is the case with most networks). As well Linkshare hardley ever comes to ABW.

    ABW members have driven LS, CJ, PJ and other Networks away, Which is really to bad.
    Last edited by MichaelColey; January 14th, 2011 at 05:33 PM.
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  2. #2
    Full Member Lanny's Avatar
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    @kse LS Moderator has been here, a lot, and recently
    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    I dought the network network cares (as is the case with most networks). As well Linkshare hardley ever comes to ABW.
    ABW members have driven LS, CJ, PJ and other Networks away, Which is really to bad.
    I beg to differ with you. Ranae, the LinkShare Moderator, has been here, a lot. I have not seen her replying to any threads since about mid December 2010. Hopefully, she is on vacation and is not out sick or something.

    IMHO, she has tried to be very helpful, to me and to others in the LS sub forum.

  3. #3
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    ABW members have driven LS, CJ, PJ and other Networks away, Which is really to bad.
    Difficult questions have been raised, which the networks do not want to answer. Some network reps stay and answer the easy questions, others run away.
    Last edited by Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound; January 14th, 2011 at 02:35 PM. Reason: typo
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  4. #4
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    I don't want to bring this discussion further off topic (and perhaps this should be split out to keep the thread on topic), but I did want to respond to this:
    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    ABW members have driven LS, CJ, PJ and other Networks away, Which is really to bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by AffiliateHound View Post
    Difficult questions have been raised, which the networks do not want to answer. Some networks reps stay and answer the easy questions, others run away.
    Whether they're responding publicly or not, trust me - the network reps are here regularly, they do read and listen, and what affiliates say here does make a difference.

    Many times, network reps aren't at liberty to publicly respond to some things, particularly when it comes to compliance or individual circumstances. I would like to see more done publicly, but I'm happy to see things resolved privately as well.

    Other times, their legal departments restrict how involved they can be. I think that's a bogus argument, though, when you consider that some of the largest companies in the world have had highly successful representatives in community forums. Google had "GoogleGuy" at WebmasterWorld.com for years. Starwood (the parent company of Sheraton) has two "Starwood Lurkers" on FlyerTalk.com. Even within our industry, we've seen tremendous success with active representatives. Back when Todd Crawford was with CJ, he was a fabulous representative here (and CJ had a much better reputation as a result). ShareASale, buy.at and AvantLink have leveraged ABW by being active and responsive here.

    We've certainly not driven anyone away. Tough issues are brought up, but they are done so civily. As long as we keep things professional and respectful, I think they'll continue to increase their participation in the community.

    On our end, I think it's important that we continue to bring up both the good and bad (constructively), that we help them feel welcome and that we understand when they can't respond publicly or when they don't respond as quickly as we like.

    Now back to the topic at hand...
    Michael Coley
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  5. #5
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelColey View Post
    Perhaps this thread might be better titled as "LinkShare Merchants With Outdated Creatives"? leeann, let me know if you want me to change it.
    Again what does Linkshare have to do with it!! It is a problem with a merchant not the network.
    Last edited by MichaelColey; January 14th, 2011 at 03:37 PM. Reason: Fixed quote.
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  6. #6
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    It's a problem on all networks, but this thread is about the merchants on LinkShare who have this problem. Maybe those are the only merchants that leeann was concerned about, or maybe she thinks LinkShare might find it mutually beneficial to encourage their merchants to keep their creative updated.

    If you think a general thread (or a similar thread about other networks) might be more appropriate, you're welcome to start one.
    Michael Coley
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  7. #7
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    My whole point here is the Negative attitude towards CJ, GAN, LS, PJ at ABW

    I make alot of money from affiliate marketing and I work with Merchants on CJ, GAN, LS, PJ, & SAS. All Networks have merchants that SUCK, some more then others.
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  8. #8
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    I understand that, but we're not going to turn a blind eye to problems just so that the networks can feel good about themselves. ABestWeb.com is the place for affiliates to bring up issues with networks, merchants, and other players in the industry. Things were presented constructively and civily here, and it was pointed out numerous times by several people that other networks have the same problem.
    Michael Coley
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  9. #9
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    All the code words have been used, again and again, let's see:

    civily
    professional
    respectful
    constructively

    Not sure why you feel the need to continually push it when that's how it is usually.

    The reality is there was more participation from those networks when apparently this place wasn't all the code words (a myth)

    Stephen Messer posted back then, CJ had Todd posting back then, GAN was posting more back then.

    Do you know why? Because maybe networks aren't worried about quiet lil threads on the internet. I'm talking about when it comes to tough topics like when affiliates feel something bad is going on, theft, other issues. It's going to have some emotion. The last thing a network wants is attention to those things. Sometimes when it got attention, a little loud, you couldn't hide from it, so they came here to address it.

    Just one example:

    CJ + COC = BULLSH!T?
    http://www.abestweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1515

    Ruckus raised, network comes to address/spin it. Of course nowadays that title would be rewritten to make it more "network friendly" with CJ Compliance Issues
    Last edited by Trust; January 14th, 2011 at 05:31 PM.

  10. #10
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    Moderator Note: Off-Topic Discussion Split Off

    Quote Originally Posted by Trust View Post
    Not sure why you feel the need to continually push it when that's how it is usually.
    I'm pointing it out because kse is saying that we're running the networks off. I don't believe that to be the case.

    You're saying just the opposite, that we're being too civil.

    When people are complaining about not being civil enough while others are complaining about being too civil, I think that shows that we have the right balance.

    Probably one of the most successful campaigns against network stupidity was the "No LMI" campaign, which was handled civily and professionally.

    You use the example of the CJ + COC = BULLSH!T thread, but what did that accomplish? The COC was a compromise that essentially legitimized parasites. I think it didn't go anywhere near far enough.
    Michael Coley
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  11. #11
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    This "Split Off" takes away from my post and the point I was trying to make. Since you have edited and moved my post around, can you please delete my post in this new thread.
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  12. #12
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    The major networks don't really want to be here, really no need too. The smaller networks are here participating (good thing) because it's smart marketing and it helps grow their networks. So civil or not, regarding major networks, really plays no part in them posting here. It's as simple as looking at when they do post here.

    "You use the example of the CJ + COC = BULLSH!T thread, but what did that accomplish? The COC was a compromise that essentially legitimized parasites. I think it didn't go anywhere near far enough. "

    I agree. That was brought up in regards to what I posted above, about when they post here. The last thing somebody wants when things aren't going right, bad stuff happening, is ATTENTION. And when they get it, they feel the need to address it somehow. You're thinking we can make ABW the most civil place on the internet, that they'll starting posting here. I'm saying it doesn't even matter and I base that on actual history. What you can do is a little less of the pushing of the above code words, stop editing thread titles, like you did with my last thread, just basically leave people be and only mod when necessary, don't go looking to mod. That will help participation. More affiliates, more network participation. Simple formula.

  13. #13
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    I talked with several network reps this week at ASW11, and they really do want to participate, but they want to make sure (using the phrase one of them used) that "they're given a fair shake". I'm just saying that there needs to be a balance between civility and bringing up issues. If we keep it professional, everyone wins.
    Michael Coley
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  14. #14
    ABW Ambassador
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelColey View Post
    I talked with several network reps this week at ASW11, and they really do want to participate, but they want to make sure (using the phrase one of them used) that "they're given a fair shake". I'm just saying that there needs to be a balance between civility and bringing up issues. If we keep it professional, everyone wins.
    They're working you, nothing more. They can post here anytime they want. You've been admin here for over a year now, where they at?

    What does "fair shake" mean? To the networks it probably means, we'll post at ABW, if you make sure nobody brings up bad stuff about us, that kind of thing.

    So they'll post here if "they're given a fair shake". What does that mean to you?

    The other thread you started in the Midnight Forum about parasites and major networks. If you feel those networks are ripe with parasites and theft, is that professional? We should let them dictate the terms of their participation here?

    It should be whatever it is, organic.
    Last edited by Trust; January 14th, 2011 at 06:28 PM.

  15. #15
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    From the start, I've known that it would take time to bring people and companies back into the forums. I knew that some would believe from the start that things have changed, but many would need to see it over time.

    I asked the same questions about a fair shake. They're open to criticism but, like I said above, they want to make sure they aren't attacked and that people realize that some things will have to be resolved privately.

    The networks aren't dictating the terms of participation here. If they want to participate, they need to meet ABW's terms. That means affiliates are free to bring up issues and problems. Likewise, affiliates need to meet ABW's terms by being civil and respectful.
    Michael Coley
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