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  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador
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    In case anyone missed it (my post is based off the information supplied by andy from SierraTradingPost.com)

    http://abw.infopop.cc/eve/ubb.x?a=tp...7329#362107329

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>After this whole issue came up, Linkshare told EdealsEtc that they were aware of their practices months before the award was given, yet they did not tell EdealsEtc that they were out of compliance, and still awarded it to them. This is a big mistake by Linkshare. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    So linkshare gave edealsetc (who is still in their network) an award, knowing full well that edealsetc had cheated! And then to try and hide the fact that they were lying, to try and show what a great network they were, they hired MS B to check edealsetc - all the while knowing they had cheated!! They set her up to fail and then be able to use her as a patsy - "Look we even hired someone from your community, what more do you want from us!"

    After this, how can anyone stay with linkshare? To hell with the apology from edealsetc, where is the apology from linkshare? Where is the admission that they lied to everyone involved because they wanted to knowingly reward a cheater!?!? Linkshare is anti-cheat, because they say so? Or because they tried to award someone they know had cheated?

    Do you really think Storytime Steve didn't know of this? Are we to assume he has no idea what is going on with their big award that had blown up in their face? Did he okay the award knowing cheating had been done?

    All the empty words by Steve and company, and they knowingly reward a cheat. I think it is time linkshare cleaned house, and it should start at the top.

    Can one linkshare merchant defend the actions that have taken place here?

    Chet

  2. #2
    ABW Ambassador Ron Bechdolt's Avatar
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    Chet,

    Thanks for starting this post rather than rerouting Andy's post. Good idea.

    This one bit of information after all that has transpired will do more to make current merchants think about moving, more to keep new merchants from signing up with linkshare and give all affiliates cause to consider what has been going on than just about anything so far.
    Ron Bechdolt | Affiliate Program Management Consultant
    7 Days A Week Marketing

  3. #3
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    We need a support forum where affiliates can find replacements for their Linkshare merchants.

    I checked shareasale and can't find anything suitable.

  4. #4
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    Have you guys both dropped all Linkshare merchants?

    I see a lot of calls for people to do just that, yet no one makes the first move.

  5. #5
    pph Expert! Gordon's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> We need a support forum where affiliates can find replacements for their Linkshare merchants. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think we need one for CJ as well, lets not forget they are just as bad if not worse than Linkshare for letting parasites and cheats get away with it.

    I've had a COC violition in since 10/10/2004 and I am waiting for a reply for over 10 days now and the website in question is still cheating by cookie stuffing from what I can see.
    One day parasites and their ilk will be made illegal, I bet a few Lawyers will be pissed off when the day comes.
    Mr. Spitzer is fetching it nearer

    YouTrek

  6. #6
    pph Expert! Gordon's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Have you guys both dropped all Linkshare merchants? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Why is it that everybody seems to think the only way to beat the parasites is to drop all Linkshare or CJ merchants? Do they not realise that all they are doing is feeding the friggin parasites and cheats even more?
    It is a good idea if you are not making much with the merchants and can replace them with no loss of income but if the merchant is a major part of your income why the hell should the affiliate have to lose that as well?

    The ONLY way to beat them is either in a court of Law or for the Networks to ban them and their tactics.

    It is not fair to ask affiliates to take a huge drop in earnings just to divert the real solutions away from the real culprits the Networks.
    One day parasites and their ilk will be made illegal, I bet a few Lawyers will be pissed off when the day comes.
    Mr. Spitzer is fetching it nearer

    YouTrek

  7. #7
    ABW Ambassador swampy_webber's Avatar
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    Gordon,

    I agree. I think the problem needs dealt with. Admittedly, I don't know how we achieve this but by dropping Linkshare, CJ, etc. we haven't cured anything.
    Life is like a dogsled team. If you ain't the lead dog, the scenery never changes.

    -- Lewis Grizzard

  8. #8
    ABW Ambassador Nova's Avatar
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    It's like winned your kitty!
    Slowly pulling away from Linkshare and pulling links and not do anymore wasted time on links from them! What ever links is left it may be left there forever or will probably be pulled also when time is available!

    The messed up thing is Ms. B has been used.
    I am so sorry that they've used Miss B and it is really sad that the merchant is even trying to make an excuse for what had been done.
    I don't think it would be any different even the person is not an active member of ABW it is still (I can't think of the best word to put).

    There's no justice to any of this (for now!) and I am sure is sick on my tummy because of this issue!

    It is really shame that this person is an ABW member that took us all for a ride and talking about back stabbing!

    What a wacky world we live in!

    What COC stand for? Crooks Overwriting Commission
    Don't worry tracking is Infected

    Live life to the fullest, You only get 1 chance. Enjoy it while you can... Nothing last forever!

  9. #9
    pph Expert! Gordon's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> It is really shame that this person is an ABW member that took us all for a ride and talking about back stubbing! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You are very correct in this post Nova, the only change I would make to this would be "stabbing" instead of "stubbing"
    One day parasites and their ilk will be made illegal, I bet a few Lawyers will be pissed off when the day comes.
    Mr. Spitzer is fetching it nearer

    YouTrek

  10. #10
    ABW Ambassador Nova's Avatar
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    Thanks Gordy.

    Stub
    Stab
    it still feel pain in my back!

    What COC stand for? Crooks Overwriting Commission
    Don't worry tracking is Infected

    Live life to the fullest, You only get 1 chance. Enjoy it while you can... Nothing last forever!

  11. #11
    Defender of Truth, Justice and the Affiliate Way
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    Gordo you are absolutely right..why should affiliates have to do that? Affiliates should be able to go to any Network they want (based off of completely different factors than fraud by their affiliate pool) and get paid for what they have rightful earned.

    And where are Merchants going to go if they drop LS? CJ? BF? PFX? Same stuff happens there. The dropping of a Network or Merchant over these issues is more of a pressure technique to attempt to force them into implementing change.

    Thing is...it's not a real solution. And it's way past the time for a real solution. And unless all Networks start putting into place and following through with real solutions, all this stuff is just going to continue to get nastier and nastier.

    No more spin, no more hype....just real solutions are what we should be seeing coming out of the Networks.

    Sorry if I'm coming off a bit harsh sounding here. I had a bit of a silly accident today and I'm not feeling the best right now. It's probably making making my patience even less at the moment. I think I'll go take a bit of a rest and get over the grumpies. But dang it, it's past time to get off of the pot.

  12. #12
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    [QUOTEThing is...it's not a real solution. And it's way past the time for a real solution. And unless all Networks start putting into place and following through with real solutions, all this stuff is just going to continue to get nastier and nastier.
    ] [/QUOTE]

    Pretty much sums up what I ahve said from the beginning in here

    I think I posted in the STP thread something about having a backbone

    Hope you start feeling better quick

  13. #13
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AFP aka Ms. B:

    And it's way past the time for a real solution. And unless _all_ Networks start putting into place and following through with real solutions, all this stuff is just going to continue to get nastier and nastier.

    No more spin, no more hype....just real solutions are what we should be seeing coming out of the Networks.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    remember the movie - I'm mad as Hell and not taking it anymore? That's how I feel.


    The time for BS excuses is OVER - they know what they need to do and I don't think it is asking too much to expect for them to do it.
    Ebudae


  14. #14
    Prince of Content Vinny O'Hare's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Have you guys both dropped all Linkshare merchants?

    I see a lot of calls for people to do just that, yet no one makes the first move <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I havent got rid of linkshare yet but i canm tell you I have dropped about 200 merchants from it I am now down to 5 and they are ARC and WSO programs so yes in a way you can say I have dropped linkshare.
    Vinny O'Hare - OPM - Contact Info email: vinny at teamloxly.com ~ 702-582-6742 Twitter

  15. #15
    ABW Ambassador Ron Bechdolt's Avatar
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    I dropped about seven, but more important I'm getting several emails a week from LS merchants asking me to join. I politely tell them why I won't join any more LS merchants and direct them to all the links here. Amazingly enough, every one of them has told me they already know about all this are quite upset about the way LS has handled all this.
    Ron Bechdolt | Affiliate Program Management Consultant
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  16. #16
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    Hello Everyone,

    Let me begin by saying, it should be the Networks responsibility as a "trusted" third party to weed out the parasites. Unfortunately, that does not happen, and I think we all know why. This then begs the question, what can be done about it?

    I can't begin to tell you how hard it is to be in my situation, a merchant on Linkshare's network who will not succumb to parasitic behavior. Now, don't cry for me, but just hear me out. I Like the Linkshare Network. I think their way of tracking is terrific. I honestly believe it is better. I know there are going to be those of you that reply to this and think otherwise, but from the research I have done, and the education I have received leads me to believe this wholeheartedly.

    Is there a problem, YES! No one can deny that. I don't know if someone has suggested this already, but my personal opinion on how to get any Network clean is to educate the participating merchants. Good and knowledgable Affiliate Managers are few and far between, the industry is just too young. So merchants stick a marketing guy in there and say "run with it". This marketing guy (or girl) sees 180 solutions sign up and start raking in thousands of dollars of sales and thinks "cool". He doesn't know how or why, all he knows is that it looks great on paper. All along, 3 offices down, the SEO & SEM guy who is running the CPC campaign can't figure out why his conversions were cut in half.

    Further, it is not enough to educate just the affiliate manager. He/She could be shady enough to just look the other way. Inevitibly, there is someone who is responsible for both the affiliate and SEO/CPC side of a company that has to be told that the company is paying twice on many sales in the affiliate program. They will flip. This will eventually lead to A) Pressure on the Networks from the Merchants to do their job and clean out the parasites or B) Lawsuits against the Networks to redeem stolen commissions.

  17. #17
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Have you guys both dropped all Linkshare merchants? ~Abu
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Personally, I canned 'em all except for 2 WSO programs that I got talked into using, and one other.

    Thing is, I did *that* years ago after discovering LS to be a haven of deadbeats and thieves (thieving merchants, that is)!

    Edited to add: I have no big reason to keep those last three, either, and will be relieved to return my sites to their glorious LS-free status!
    There is no knowledge that is not power. ~Hemingway

  18. #18
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
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    I'm down to three merchants. Soon to be two as a check just came in. When the others pay out, bye-bye LS. It's a pity because there are some good merchants on LS, if you're lucky enough to find them.

    I got rid of Collections Etc. first, Abu. Remember?

  19. #19
    pph Expert! Gordon's Avatar
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    I've never used many Linkshare merchants mainly because I refused to pay for the access to their datafeeds.

    I just cannot for the life of me understand why we affiliates are being asked to pay a Network for access to a merchants datafeed to help us to make better sales. I always thought that was what the Networks wanted us to do so they could get more comissions from the merchants.

    This just shows how low the affiliates have really sunk in the Networks peoples minds/scales.
    One day parasites and their ilk will be made illegal, I bet a few Lawyers will be pissed off when the day comes.
    Mr. Spitzer is fetching it nearer

    YouTrek

  20. #20
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    They didn't count on us finding out that they knew all along that they were giving the award to a cheat. LS does the donkey dance even more than CJ!
    Comments are opinion unless otherwise noted. Remember, pillage first. Then burn. Half of all people in the world have IQs under 100. You best learn to trust ol' SSanf!

  21. #21
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> LS does the donkey dance even more than CJ!
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    There is no knowledge that is not power. ~Hemingway

  22. #22
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Edited out by SSanf
    Comments are opinion unless otherwise noted. Remember, pillage first. Then burn. Half of all people in the world have IQs under 100. You best learn to trust ol' SSanf!

  23. #23
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
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    Continued Success,

    Haiko
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  24. #24
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    In the words of the great philosopher, more isn't better, better is better.

  25. #25
    Full Member Travelin Man's Avatar
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    Quote: "Over 90% of the new clients did not previously have an affiliate program
    solution -- the relationship with LinkShare will be their first entry into
    this performance-based marketing industry. More and more businesses are
    looking to affiliate marketing to help them achieve greater reach online
    effectively and efficiently."

    This is very interesting. I wonder if these newbies really know what they are getting into?
    Travelin' Man

    "If you don't know where you are going, any road will lead you there." -- unknown

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