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  1. #1
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Seems the Cable News channels are running with the PayDay Loans rip-off artists your see popping up all over the networks. They caharge up to 200% interest on the short term loans and peddle the privacy info to any and all buyers. Guy just interviewed took out 3 loans for a total of 800.00. Within just 3 weeks he owed the loan con-men over $2300.00. Talk about loan sharks

    Don't send a darn person to these cut and run type loan sharks unless your just a sleezeball too.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

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  2. #2
    Affiliate Manager Allen Nance's Avatar
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    Mike,

    I have to agree with you on this. It's too bad that these kind of outfits can prosper and get around banking laws.

    It's also too bad that the public is stupid. Yes, the stupid, uneducated public that is usually lower income will line up at the store fronts or click to death the online sites of crooks. Those that use these kind of loan sharking fronts puts them in my "idiot of the day" box.

    Then the affiliates with no scruples that promote these sites, I consider that they are no better than any parasite application out there. Helping to bilk John Q. Public.

    Folks, do yourself a favor and go to sleep and wake up with a good conceious. Drop these f(*$ers and their 30% a week interest. Your doing a disservice to your visitors, yourself, and all of us in the affiliate marketing industry.

    You got my poop for this day.
    Poopie Nubert

  3. #3
    ABW Ambassador Spencer's Avatar
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    I don't remember who it was, but a former professional football player opened up a few of these franchises here in California. He said that he makes more money now, than he did when he was playing football. Don't know how they get by the usuary laws, but they get rich off the misfortune of 1000's.

  4. #4
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
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    These types of loans are illegal in about 1/2 of all US states. Pushing them online is venturing into a legal grey area.

    The interest rate actually can be as high as 600%! You will notice also that they are always run from out of the US.
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  5. #5
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Guy just interviewed took out 3 loans for a total of 800.00. Within just 3 weeks he owed the loan con-men over $2300.00. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Dayum, and here I thought Home Equity Loans were the front for the soul-selling business.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Don't send a darn person to these cut and run type loan sharks unless your just a sleezeball too. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Mixed reaction as I agree but then remember that my first really good performer from circa 2000 was one of *those*...
    There is no knowledge that is not power. ~Hemingway

  6. #6
    Affiliate Miester my2cents's Avatar
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    MIKE,

    guess I'm a sleeze ball.... I do really well with payday loans...

    It's not my fault the people who get them have no credit or dont know how to live within their means!

    JOe
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    that's my2cents, 'cuz I'm a legend in my own mind....

  7. #7
    Kung Fu Master Eathan's Avatar
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    Selling off the applicant's personal info is well shady, but otherwise these are a legit offering.

    The people who take out the loans need some serious lessons in personal finance, but the fees are at least clear up front and the people know what they're getting into as far as payment schedules and so on. It may be unfortunate, but it's not like there are a bunch of other lenders looking to step in and loan to people with no credit and poor money management skills...
    Eathan Mertz

    Black Cat Mining - Gold Prospecting & Rockhounding Equipment

  8. #8
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Well you can bet when a total of 200 PayDay loan storefronts quickly jumps to over 23,000 this market is full of outright crooks. Imagine the herd of legal sheisters these guys hire to repo everything the duped idiots have before they throw them out on the street. Those 23,000 are licenced businesses with an address. On the Net there is no need for this with just a 25.00 site and the entry fee to the 2nd tier affiliate networks.

    The info peddling must be rampent with identity thieves seeking victims.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

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  9. #9
    Internet Cowboy
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    These people make a LOT of money on the bad luck and lack of common sense of people.
    No matter where you are in America, look around you. If you are within a mile of one of these outfits, you are within a mile of five of them. You will also be in the poor area of town.
    They feed on those who are uneducated and down on their luck.
    I have said before and will say again that the loan sharking business is best left to the maffia.
    I would not promote one of these outfits if I knew it would double my bottom line. We all have our standards and our morals.

    On a side note, I am agreeing with Mike FAR too much these days. That scares me


  10. #10
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by scohaz:
    No matter where you are in America, look around you. If you are within a mile of one of these outfits, you are within a mile of five of them. You will also be in the poor area of town.: <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Unfortunately, I have to disagree with that comment of being in the poor area of town. I live in an affluent area and you find these places everywhere; Sad to say, you don't have to be poor to be in debt (technically speaking). I would guess most of my neighbors in their million dollar houses have some form of debt. So yes, while many of us aren't dumb enough to get ourselves in debt, many others do and this is just one outlet for them to get money.

    Yes, some are sheisters, but we all know for years that credit card companies have usurous interest rates as well, and many affiliates make even more money off of those than people make off of pay day loans.


    I'm not condoning promoting pay day loans one way or the other, just stating that there is a lot of ambiguity in what people consider ethical or moral or whatever. For most people the bottom line is how much money they make, and like anything in this world, you'll do what you can to make it honestly, and unfortunately with many others, dishonestly too.

    Just my opinion,
    Robin

  11. #11
    Kung Fu Master Eathan's Avatar
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    Mike,

    I'm not so sure...

    The business model of the loan companies is lucrative enough without adding selling of contact info to the mix, though I hear reselling is a pretty common practice among lead brokers.

    As for why so many companies, I'd guess most of those online are lead brokers. They're the ones selling the info to 100 different loan companies (all trying to get clean, exclusive leads), and the ones to avoid.

    For the other 23,000, it's a pretty easy line of money lending to get into. It doesn't take much capital. You loan $500 and get $535 back in two weeks. Makes sense they'd spring up everywhere. There would still be risks though, for both borrower and lender...

    Stuff doesn't get repoed, not by the payday advance lender, but you can bet a lot of people get sent to collections. I imagine someone defaults on a loan and the lender sells the debt to a collections company straight away. The collections company can annoy and mess up their credit, but I don't believe they can actually take property.

    Really, it's not much different than other forms of lending/credit, just a higher risk borrower, so much worse loan terms.
    Eathan Mertz

    Black Cat Mining - Gold Prospecting & Rockhounding Equipment

  12. #12
    ABW Ambassador Paul_Ward's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by scohaz:
    I would not promote one of these outfits if I knew it would double my bottom line. We all have our standards and our morals. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Too right, another one to add to the list along with online pharmacies.

    Hey wait a minute, maybe crack dealers are only responding to a need too and it's the free will of those hooked to get hooked in the first place and continue to take the drugs - it's their fault for not paying attention in school and being stupid, squeeze 'em until the pips squeak and then reposess the pips.

  13. #13
    Kung Fu Master Eathan's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Too right, another one to add to the list along with online pharmacies. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    There are the pushers selling hydrocodone and vicodin to junkies, but there are also legit companies not much different than the corner pharmacy/chemist. Every industry covers a similar spectrum.

    REM mentioned credit card companies. Do they meet everyone's moral litmus test? I once got a card with a $200 line of credit and a $35 annual fee when really strapped. I don't see much difference. I borrowed when I bought my house as well. Again, not much difference...

    It may be unfortunate that those in greater need often have worse credit and pay much higher interest, outrageous fees and so on, but that's how credit works. We all still use it.
    Eathan Mertz

    Black Cat Mining - Gold Prospecting & Rockhounding Equipment

  14. #14
    ABW Ambassador Jane's Avatar
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    I used to refuse to promote places like payday loans, but now that they are on every street corner I have given in. I do post a warning on my page to people about the high interest rates and that they shouldn't use the service unless they are desperate.
    Your car breaks down, you can't go to work, you have no credit you can't get it fixed. Payday loans can be useful.

    Told my son he should go there instead of calling me. I have to pay Western Union $25.00 and then pay a cash advance charge on my credit card because I do it online instead of driving to a store and giving them cash. Actually costs more than payday loans.

    Many people get in trouble with it because they have no sense.

  15. #15
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    I think it is disgusting seeing all those affiliate sites recommending certain payday loan sites. I seriously doubt they even know what they are pushing on their visitors and getting them into. Probably never even read the loans terms.

    But that is what the internet is all about for some dirtbags. Pathetic LOSERS who could not sell legitimate products and took up scamming people in a bind.

  16. #16
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    I promote various affiliate programs and payday loans is one of the lowest paying at an average of $8 - $10 a lead. In fact it's the worst paying for any type of loan.

    It all depends on what as an affiliate you believe your role to be. My role is to direct traffic to the most reputable and honest pay day loan companies. Companies with solid reputations. I could actually promote other companies that pay 20% more, but the interest they charge is also ridiculous.

    I also promote online casinos. With online casinos there are dozens who will take money and never return it, or who will steal in the form of having 'rigged' software. My goal as an affiliate of online casinos is to make sure that I direct all of my traffic to safe and honest estalishments with proven track records.

    When it comes to online pharmacies it's almost ridiculous not to promote them. If there were no affiliates any pharmacy could get listed high using seo. But affiliates, especially reputable ones can get listed high in the search engines, and help in instructing users which pharmacies to shop at. Many pharmacies ship products with misleading labels or incorrect ingredients. These are extremely harmful. As an affiliate I have the opportunity to send traffic to legitimate pharmacies with 100% legitimate ingredients. Of course there are some products I will never promote and other affiliates promote them, but with those products I rather not get involved in the first place.

    Basically as an affiliate I can do my homework on who is good versus who is a scam, and save people thousands in the long run. Unfortunately some affiliates dont do their homework, but you can hardly blame every affiliate for that.

    Antoine

  17. #17
    ABW Ambassador Paul_Ward's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by antoine tardif:
    I also promote online casinos......

    When it comes to online pharmacies it's almost ridiculous not to promote them.....
    Antoine <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I think those of us who will never promote online gambling, pharamcies or rip-off loans do it for our own personal moral reasons.

    Yes they will exist whether I promote them or not and plenty of other people will promote them. But I've been around the block a few times and seen the harm that out of control debt, self prescribing medications and gambling addictions can do to the gullible, the vulnerable and in particular their completely innocent families.

    If I make it easier for a few people to get into problems while I make a fast buck or two, then it's happening because of what I do and I think it is an amoral decision to shrug your shoulders and take the poisoned commission under the protection of any excuse you may come up with.

    But then it's the choice of the individual to promote or to buy or to subscribe. I just know that I choose not to and I sleep at night all the more easily for it.

  18. #18
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    Online casinos and payday loans. That is quite a combo there. Promote online gambling, get em hooked, drain their accounts, then keep them going with payday loans.

  19. #19
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    LOL...Antoine might just run the affiliate biz as a sideline to his real jobs as a bail bondsman, repo-man and baby seal club maker. Welcome to ABW where 10,000 lurkers will learn the fine art of choosing the best of the worst.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

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  20. #20
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    Is the baby seal club affiliate program on CJ or L$ ??

  21. #21
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> LOL...Antoine might just run the affiliate biz as a sideline to his real jobs as a bail bondsman, repo-man and baby seal club maker. Welcome to ABW where 10,000 lurkers will lean the fine art of choosing the best of the worst. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Haha.

    But Mike, as a service to his visitors he only promotes the most reputable and honest payday loans and baby seal clubs. Tries em out himself I'll bet.

  22. #22
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    I could really care less about your negative comments. I figured that my post would not be popular, but it was 100% honest.


    I'm not going to bother posting any more anyway, there are plenty of message boards out there that are not flames. I'm just sorry that the administrator has to deal with this type of infantile behavior.

    Warm regards,

    Antoine

  23. #23
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Adam Ward:
    Is the baby seal club affiliate program on CJ or L$ ?? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Gotta be LinkSnare...
    There is no knowledge that is not power. ~Hemingway

  24. #24
    Full Member AAnnAArchy's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jimbo2002:
    Online casinos and payday loans. That is quite a combo there. Promote online gambling, get em hooked, drain their accounts, then keep them going with payday loans. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Bah, it's no different than promoting QVC, because there are plenty of people with shopping addictions. It's not our job to police what people do with their money. Well, it may be your job, but it's not my job. But then, gamblers pay my state taxes, so I like 'em.

  25. #25
    Affiliate Manager
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    I actually totally agree with antoine. As an affiliate, it's our job to show customers the best places to do their shopping online.
    As for gambling, gamblers are already searching for an online casino, so why not show them the best online casino around, where they will actually get paid when they do win. Of course, there will always be people with gambling addictions, but what can I do about that, except that I tell them where to get help if they have a problem.
    Same with online pharmacies and same with payday loans. People need medications and they need payday loans, so show them the most reputable online companies around, so they don't get ripped of.
    I don't see any problem with promoting any of these verticals, as long as affiliate marketers do their research and promote only the most reputable companies out there.
    Thomas Burgemeister - Affiliate Manager
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