Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 103
  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador Paul_Ward's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Cambridgeshire, England
    Posts
    1,573
    Zappos terms got worse again
    When I started with Zappos they paid 15% and had a 365 days cookie.

    Now it's 12%, 30 day cookie and now they will only pay for new customers, not for anyone who has bought from them before.

    Time to start looking elsewhere and diversifying I think.

  2. Thanks From:

  3. #2
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 24th, 2005
    Posts
    6,918
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_Ward View Post
    ...now they will only pay for new customers, not for anyone who has bought from them before.
    Where do you see that in their TOS?
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  4. #3
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
    Join Date
    November 20th, 2005
    Posts
    8,266
    Time to start looking elsewhere and diversifying I think.
    ALWAYS be diversified.
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

  5. #4
    The "other" left wing davidh's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    3,492
    Here's what I see in terms for "Existing Customer"

    Number of Occurrences Unlimited
    I'll assume that these are the current terms, as they were updated two days ago.
    CUSTOM BANNERS by GRAPHICS CANDY ~ Banner Sets and Website Graphics ~ Professional design, reasonable rates
    DESIGNER DOG CHECKS ~ We double-dog dare ya to write one!

  6. Thanks From:

  7. #5
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    You've misunderstood their email. They only want to differentiate between New and Existing customers, that is it. Existing customer sales will be tracked and commissioned normally as before.
    If you look on the merchant info page, you will see that they have 2 set of terms. One for new customers and second for Existing customers, and they both are identical. So no need to worry

  8. Thanks From:

  9. #6
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
    Join Date
    November 29th, 2005
    Posts
    2,511
    Quote Originally Posted by Nabz View Post
    If you look on the merchant info page, you will see that they have 2 set of terms. One for new customers and second for Existing customers, and they both are identical. So no need to worry
    For now
    MERCHANTS: Start showing your coupons directly on your site, that way your shoppers will stop leaving your site looking for them!! If not then remove your Coupon Box!!

  10. Thanks From:

  11. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    February 8th, 2008
    Location
    London, UK. Innit!
    Posts
    157
    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    For now
    My thoughts exactly - differentiating them is the first step. The changes will come when they realize how many sales are, in fact, existing customers.

  12. #8
    ABW Ambassador Paul_Ward's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Cambridgeshire, England
    Posts
    1,573
    Ah - ok - I did just skim through it I guess.

    Anyhow - 2 sets of terms, currently identical but for existing and new customers. Now call me a but I don't see either of them improving in the future.

  13. #9
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 22nd, 2007
    Location
    West Covina, CA
    Posts
    8,443
    Quote Originally Posted by alphawave View Post
    My thoughts exactly - differentiating them is the first step. The changes will come when they realize how many sales are, in fact, existing customers.
    The vast majority of merchants understand that prior customers sometimes return to their site due to the efforts of their affiliates.

    An existing customer should be defined as a customer who, when they wish to purchase a product, goes directly to the site of a merchant from whom they had made a prior purchase.

    An existing customer should not be defined as a customer who visits one or more sites, including affiliate sites, and eventually clicks a link randomly taking them to a landing page on a merchant site, resulting in their making a purchase from a merchant from whom they at some time in the past made a prior purchase.

    If the customer is THEIR customer, they would NOT be searching for the product elsewhere, and only return to a merchant site from whom they previously made a purchase by virtue of happenstance. If the customer is searching for the right product to buy and ends up at a merchant site through an affiliate link and makes a purchase, the affiliate did their job, pre-sold the product, engineered the sale, and earned the commission. The customer's prior history with the merchant was meaningless.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
    "If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?" -John Wooden;
    "Raj, there’s no place for truth on the internet." -Howard Wolowitz[/SIZE]

  14. Thanks From:

  15. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    February 8th, 2008
    Location
    London, UK. Innit!
    Posts
    157
    The vast majority of merchants understand that prior customers sometimes return to their site due to the efforts of their affiliates.

    An existing customer should be defined as a customer who, when they wish to purchase a product, goes directly to the site of a merchant from whom they had made a prior purchase.

    An existing customer should not be defined as a customer who visits one or more sites, including affiliate sites, and eventually clicks a link randomly taking them to a landing page on a merchant site, resulting in their making a purchase from a merchant from whom they at some time in the past made a prior purchase.

    If the customer is THEIR customer, they would NOT be searching for the product elsewhere, and only return to a merchant site from whom they previously made a purchase by virtue of happenstance. If the customer is searching for the right product to buy and ends up at a merchant site through an affiliate link and makes a purchase, the affiliate did their job, pre-sold the product, engineered the sale, and earned the commission. The customer's prior history with the merchant was meaningless.
    Agreed, existing customers still provide value for myself and Zappos therefore commissions will/should always be payable.

    But you can't disagree when I say that a new customer is probably worth more to them than an existing one. That's why I can see future terms being changed somehow, for existing customer purchases through the affiliate channel.

    I hope I'm wrong.

  16. #11
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    I actually also think that Zappos is considering paying only for new customers. This should be expected given the reputation of Amazon affiliate programs. Their own program have single session 24 hour cookie. Endless.com has single occurrence policy with 15 day cookies. If my memory serves me correctly, Zappos cookie duration was dropped to 30 days after Amazon takeover, then they changed their policy to not pay commission on their promotional emails. Then they stopped paying commission for their VIP customers.
    I think Zappos affiliate program will continue to go downhill until it fulfills the standards of Amazon.

  17. #12
    OPM and Moderator Chuck Hamrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 5th, 2005
    Location
    Park City Utah
    Posts
    16,646
    If a merchant is Soo big that their new products, deals and clearance are bewildering, that's where affiliate fill the advertising gap. If an affiliate has a site for Ladies Blue Shoes that lists several merchants and a consumer finds one from Zappos then that affiliate should be compensated.

  18. #13
    ABW Ambassador Abigail's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Fraser Valley, BC Canada
    Posts
    1,100
    the spin i took from the email they sent out, after i read it a few times was that they want to educate themselves as who is setting up an (email) account with them - then purchasing - these are existing customers and those who are purchasing without setting up the pre account. however after saying that i am looking into my crystal ball - which is somewhat cloudy of late - possibly, they may be aligning themselves to adjust commissions - 12% maybe for new customers and something lower perhaps 6% for existing customers. time will tell - i expect any major change, if there is to be one, will come at the beginning of the new year.

  19. #14
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    Quote Originally Posted by Abigail View Post
    the spin i took from the email they sent out, after i read it a few times was that they want to educate themselves as who is setting up an (email) account with them - then purchasing - these are existing customers and those who are purchasing without setting up the pre account. however after saying that i am looking into my crystal ball - which is somewhat cloudy of late - possibly, they may be aligning themselves to adjust commissions - 12% maybe for new customers and something lower perhaps 6% for existing customers. time will tell - i expect any major change, if there is to be one, will come at the beginning of the new year.
    Or maybe right before shopping season

  20. #15
    ABW Ambassador Abigail's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Fraser Valley, BC Canada
    Posts
    1,100
    well the blanket email i got from them yesterday blows my "take on" the first email, out of the water. all i know is that the greater volume of my business is NOT under the "New Customer" column - i find it inconceivable that 99% of my business is from "Existing" Zappos customers - i am tracking these sales back to natural search and can see the search - why would not most of the existing customers just return direct to Zappos? oh, i do have a hankering for the good ol' days.......

  21. #16
    OPM and Moderator Chuck Hamrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 5th, 2005
    Location
    Park City Utah
    Posts
    16,646
    IMHO when brands get big enough they feel that affiliates bring little value to selling to returning customers. Especially if they use frequent retention emails. I have often wondered by I see affiliates shopping sites promoting Overstock and Amazon deals. Have realized that they can do a better job getting more exposure than the merchant who is limited to one site to advertise. So Zappos is only interested in affiliates who work as customer acquisition. Maybe move your site more toward that format.

  22. #17
    ABW Ambassador Abigail's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Fraser Valley, BC Canada
    Posts
    1,100
    good point - i, myself, have wondered the same thing - makes sense.

  23. #18
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    Quote Originally Posted by Abigail View Post
    well the blanket email i got from them yesterday blows my "take on" the first email, out of the water. all i know is that the greater volume of my business is NOT under the "New Customer" column - i find it inconceivable that 99% of my business is from "Existing" Zappos customers - i am tracking these sales back to natural search and can see the search - why would not most of the existing customers just return direct to Zappos? oh, i do have a hankering for the good ol' days.......
    After accepting the terms, I noticed that each and every sale I made for whole last year and this year was titled as Existing Customer. I couldn't believe it. So I decided to wait for new sales to comes.
    My guess was right, It is some glitch labeling all sales before accepting new terms as "Existing Customer". My sales after accepting new terms is 40% New and 60% Existing.

  24. #19
    ABW Ambassador affninja's Avatar
    Join Date
    December 11th, 2005
    Location
    Nor-Cal
    Posts
    651
    According to this 2009 article, 75% of Zappos sales came from repeat customers. I suspect that percentage is even higher today. I wouldn't be surprised if 90% of their business is "existing" customers. I'll share my results once I have a little bigger data pool to draw from.
    Last edited by affninja; March 29th, 2012 at 04:56 PM. Reason: typo
    Your Ad Here.

  25. #20
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    When 10% of Internet users of U.S have shopped at Zappos, so higher percentage of existing customers should be expected.
    But the thing is Zappos will lose a lot of customers if they decide to not pay for existing customers. Affiliates will simply direct traffic to its competitors.
    I did a test with one of my large website which has $25 EPC at Zappos. I replaced all links with OnlineShoes.com and after a month the EPC was $27 (after returns in both cases), despite the fact that OnlineShoes pay 10% commission compared to Zappos 12% . So Customers don't care if its Zappos or OnlineShoes, they shop. I changed the links back after the experiment because LinkShare don't pay checks via courier while CJ does. (I don't have option of Direct Deposit for my country).
    I am now thinking to do some testing with ShoeBuy, they have very generous 17% commission. So when Zappos pulls the plug I will have already researched which links to replace with who.

  26. Thanks From:

  27. #21
    OPM and Moderator Chuck Hamrick's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 5th, 2005
    Location
    Park City Utah
    Posts
    16,646
    Excellent test Nabz, wish more affiliates did that so we can get solid numbers.

  28. #22
    ABW Ambassador affninja's Avatar
    Join Date
    December 11th, 2005
    Location
    Nor-Cal
    Posts
    651
    Now with a couple week's worth of data (more than 100 orders), I thought I'd share my findings:

    37% of orders were from New Customers -- higher than expected

    Existing Customers had a 13% higher AOV

    BUT

    Existing Customers had a 306% higher return rate (reversals)!

    Customers that know and love Zappos take full advantage or their free returns, often ordering several items and returning those they don't like (and sometimes the entire order).

    Anyone else seeing similar data?
    Your Ad Here.

  29. #23
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    Quote Originally Posted by affninja View Post
    Now with a couple week's worth of data (more than 100 orders), I thought I'd share my findings:

    37% of orders were from New Customers -- higher than expected

    Existing Customers had a 13% higher AOV

    BUT

    Existing Customers had a 306% higher return rate (reversals)!

    Customers that know and love Zappos take full advantage or their free returns, often ordering several items and returning those they don't like (and sometimes the entire order).

    Anyone else seeing similar data?
    I didn't compare the returns. Will do and share the results.

  30. #24
    Member
    Join Date
    February 8th, 2008
    Location
    London, UK. Innit!
    Posts
    157
    What was feared has happened, change of terms confirmed: 18% for new customers and 8% for existing.

  31. #25
    Moderator Nabz's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2005
    Location
    VY Canis Majoris
    Posts
    1,751
    I am in safe zone with about 40% + sale accounting to new customers. But it will be a blow to publishers with less than 30% new customer sales.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Solanova.com Terms Updated - (Bid on List of Approved Terms!)
    By Stephanie Lichtenstein in forum Andy Rodriguez Consulting
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: September 30th, 2009, 06:07 PM
  2. Ebay leaks get worse and worse
    By Amy_S in forum eBay Partner Network
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: September 23rd, 2008, 04:43 PM
  3. Zappos New Terms - Anyone Get Them Yet?
    By Superstar in forum Commission Junction - CJ
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: September 10th, 2007, 09:57 PM
  4. Zappos New Terms
    By Nature Boy in forum Commission Junction - CJ
    Replies: 69
    Last Post: March 28th, 2007, 12:51 PM
  5. Zappos - Accept new terms?
    By Airstrip in forum Commission Junction - CJ
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: December 6th, 2006, 11:43 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •