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  1. #1
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    BiblicaDirect.com "Shape up or ship out." - Don'tcha love it?
    But in this case it is, "We've shipped you out and you need to shape up to get back in."

    Received this email late Tuesday - and finally investigated (I was on the road yesterday). Already been "Declined" in SAS and the page with their display now has [PopShops] links going dead. Nice. Really nice...

    Here is the email (with names removed to protect the innocent - ha):
    Hello Bill,

    Hope is well. I am reaching out to let you know that effective immediately, XxxxxxxXxxxxx.com will only be allowing sites promoting relevant content into
    their program.

    If you are receiving this message, than your account is currently set to be declined since we were unable to find any information showing the relevancy of your campaign to our products. Please do not take offense to this decision since your site may indeed be valuable, but the decision was made to place complete focus on related sites.

    If you feel that you have received this message in error, please email xxxxxxx@XxxxxxxxxXxxxxxx.com with a relevant URL and we will allow you back into the program.

    XxxxxxxXxxxxx.com focuses on selling xxxxxx in bulk amounts, and sites promoting the following types of content are some examples of what is being considered relevant:
    One line states, "Please do not take offense at this decision... ." Well, it's not the "decision" that irritates me. But the fact that being cut off with no notice created a "dead" page before I had a chance to respond or react - really irks me.

    Couldn't find any relevancy? I used a report in SAS to let me quickly find where I had those links ('cause I haven't had enough coffee yet this morning to get my brain up to speed ).

    Grrrrrrr.......
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

  2. #2
    ABW Ambassador isellstuff's Avatar
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    I got the same e-mail. I did not realize they had already shut me out of the program, that wasn't cool.

    I'm noticing that AM's frequently don't seem to get that the reason they aren't getting more sales is because:

    1) Their merchant doesn't have sufficient brand recognition
    2) They aren't offering the right set of products
    3) They are getting destroyed on price by the big boys.


  3. #3
    OPM and Moderator Chuck Hamrick's Avatar
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    Its hard to advocate to other affiliate to not work with a merchant who doesn't treat affiliates with respect i.e. a weeks notice to remove links. Why not call out the merchant so others can consider dropping. And so they can see this thread, affiliate responses and realize their poor decision (and grammar).

  4. #4
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Ah, but did you notice the email sent the day before?

    Thank you for joining the example.com affiliate program. Please note: I'm here to help!

    Blah-blah
    Perhaps the OPM would care to comment on the "immediate" change of status to "declined"? In our case I can understand as we're no longer in that niche, though one of our shopping search engines could have worked.

    Personally, I think instant removal shouldn't be allowed on SAS without a warning/grace period or, in the case of TOS violation(s). But hey, never about the affiliates...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

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  6. #5
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Hamrick View Post
    Why not call out the merchant so others can consider dropping.
    Because the OPM firm is held in high regard - by others...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  7. #6
    notary sojac Herb ԿԬ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convergence View Post
    Because the OPM firm is held in high regard - by others...
    but does he still manage them?

  8. #7
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herb ԿԬ View Post
    but does he still manage them?
    Email addy says so...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  9. #8
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Hamrick View Post
    ...Why not call out the merchant so others can consider dropping. And so they can see this thread, affiliate responses and realize their poor decision (and grammar).
    100% agree, I do not understand why affiliates here do not name the merchant all of the time when they do things like this. I find if you name the merchant AND the person/group that manages the program you may get answers. If not at least you give other a heads up about how they run their program.
    MERCHANTS: Start showing your coupons directly on your site, that way your shoppers will stop leaving your site looking for them!! If not then remove your Coupon Box!!

  10. #9
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convergence View Post
    Because the OPM firm is held in high regard - by others...
    So???
    MERCHANTS: Start showing your coupons directly on your site, that way your shoppers will stop leaving your site looking for them!! If not then remove your Coupon Box!!

  11. #10
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    So???
    I didn't start the thread, nor hijack it - if Bill wants to name names, that's fine...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  12. #11
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    100% agree, I do not understand why affiliates here do not name the merchant all of the time when they do things like this. I find if you name the merchant AND the person/group that manages the program you may get answers. If not at least you give other a heads up about how they run their program.
    You are more than welcome to check your inbox and see if you received the same email. You also can name names if you so desire...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  13. #12
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    Sorry, just getting back to the computer. Convergence, I did get the same email the day before.

    OK - so on Monday I was thanked for joining and was offered help to get rolling. Hmmm...I think I joined a few years back.

    Same email promised a "bonus" of sorts if I replied within three days. Well - I was axed in about 24 hours.

    Since 01/01/2010 we generated only 264 clicks, yielding 2 sales. Not too bad, conversion wise - but a paltry number of clicks for a bit over three years. The ironic part is that I basically neglected that site until a couple months ago - 70+ of those clicks were in the last 30 days. I'll pop up a partial screen shot of the page I just took offline.
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

  14. #13
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    OK - here's a screen shot of the page with (no warning) dead links...



    OK - so one of the parameters to be in the program was to have "bible-related" content. Interesting that the "neighboring" page with a similar look/feel for "Religious and Church Themed Checks" gets a couple sales every month.

    I'm not so much perturbed that BiblicaDirect.com "declined" us - because two sales in the last three-plus years is rather meager. But I am "venting" because the "plug was pulled" without notice. While not setting the world on fire, that page did have 82 unique visits in the first three days of this month.

    When I a bit of extra time I'll replace the content on that page and reactivate it.

    .
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Bill; April 4th, 2013 at 12:11 PM. Reason: Fix image link (wasn't showing in IE).
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

  15. #14
    OPM and Moderator Chuck Hamrick's Avatar
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    100% agree, I do not understand why affiliates here do not name the merchant all of the time when they do things like this. I find if you name the merchant AND the person/group that manages the program you may get answers. If not at least you give other a heads up about how they run their program.
    I can understand why Bill might not want to disclose the merchant since he has direct contact info and doesn't want retribution by the affiliate or the network which has happened before to affiliates on ABW for outing a merchant. That said I would like to update the title and move this to unethical merchants forum as a market for affiliates looking to join this merchant.

  16. #15
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    Please don't move to "Unethical." This was not unethical; I believe it was a blunder (possibly by a new hire) that needs to be corrected and, knowing the OPM firm, most likely will be corrected. On my part it is a gripe ('cause it really p*ssed me off) and may be a lesson to others.
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

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  18. #16
    ABW Ambassador writerguy's Avatar
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    Nothing about BiblicaDirect really surprises me. Years ago, when they were the "International Bible Society," I was a fairly active affiliate. In fact, they paid the first money I ever made as an affiliate. (I think it was a $98 commission on some boxes of Bibles a church ordered.)

    As a new, eager affiliate, I jumped all over IBS (as they were known then) and made a few more sales. Then I started using datafeeds on some of my sites, including theirs.

    For the next 2 or 3 years, I battled ignorance and neglect repeatedly trying to get a good, up-to-date, usable datafeed from them consistently.

    In recent years, they promised thousands of new products, while their datafeed at one point dwindled from something over 1,000 items to around 300-400.

    So I finally gave up on them, long before they've had a chance to send me their so-long/goodbye emails.

    Gary
    Generate more fake news.

  19. #17
    notary sojac Herb ԿԬ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill View Post
    Please don't move to "Unethical." This was not unethical; I believe it was a blunder (possibly by a new hire) that needs to be corrected and, knowing the OPM firm, most likely will be corrected. On my part it is a gripe ('cause it really p*ssed me off) and may be a lesson to others.
    I don't think the OPM has been handling them for a while. I doubt if they'd listen to him anyway.

    Someone in the company was probably given the chance to "take them to a new level." Unfortunately, it'll be a lower one.

  20. #18
    Outsourced Program Manager
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    Hello Everyone,

    My apologies for the inconvenience this may have caused any of you, we understand that ideally more time should have been provided but had to act quickly due to the circumstances. A mass change was required due to some sites that had joined the program prior to our management who were extremely incongruent with the clients brand. We did our best to identify relevant sites before making the change but understand that some may have been overlooked (such as Bill).

    @Bill - I've reapproved your account

    @ISellStuff - This change was not made to increase sales, but more to ensure affiliates were aligned with the brand. If you were removed in error, please let me know and we will have it corrected.

    @WriterGuy - The feed issues were corrected during the initial quarter of us taking over the program and we are working on some additional upgrades now as well. If you're willing to give it another shot, I'd personally assist you with your needs.
    Best Regards,

    Jon Nunez | President | AffiliateManager.com
    P: (682) 478-5882 | F: (407) 650-2820 |E: jon@affiliatemanager.com
    2013 Pinnacle Awards Affiliate Manager of the Year | LinkedIn
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  21. #19
    ABW Ambassador Bob Lawrence's Avatar
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    Hi Jon,
    I replied to the email, but never got a reply back yet.
    Did see in SAS where I was removed also.
    Where's the Great Life of Affiliate Marketing Hiding?

  22. #20
    Outsourced Program Manager
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    Hello Bob,

    Thanks for reaching out. I just checked my inbox and spam and I do not see a reply, however I would be happy to help. Please send me over your affiliate ID and landing page via PM so I can reapprove your account.
    Best Regards,

    Jon Nunez | President | AffiliateManager.com
    P: (682) 478-5882 | F: (407) 650-2820 |E: jon@affiliatemanager.com
    2013 Pinnacle Awards Affiliate Manager of the Year | LinkedIn
    Managed Programs | Request a Quote | Referral Program

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  24. #21
    ABW Ambassador writerguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Nunez View Post
    ... @WriterGuy - The feed issues were corrected during the initial quarter of us taking over the program and we are working on some additional upgrades now as well. If you're willing to give it another shot, I'd personally assist you with your needs.
    I do, in fact, still have a Bible-oriented site. I've sort of let it go dormant most of the last year. But I keep telling myself I need to revamp and renew it. So I may take you up on that offer for some guidance with the feed.

    Gary
    Generate more fake news.

  25. #22
    Outsourced Program Manager
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    Quote Originally Posted by writerguy View Post
    I do, in fact, still have a Bible-oriented site. I've sort of let it go dormant most of the last year. But I keep telling myself I need to revamp and renew it. So I may take you up on that offer for some guidance with the feed.

    Gary
    Hello Gary,

    That sounds great, the UPC codes have already been added, and we're working on adding some additional categories as well. Please feel free to reach out to me directly at jon@affiliatemanager.com, and I'll be more than happy to discuss the feed or anything else regarding your campaign further.
    Best Regards,

    Jon Nunez | President | AffiliateManager.com
    P: (682) 478-5882 | F: (407) 650-2820 |E: jon@affiliatemanager.com
    2013 Pinnacle Awards Affiliate Manager of the Year | LinkedIn
    Managed Programs | Request a Quote | Referral Program

  26. #23
    ABW Ambassador kse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Nunez View Post
    Hello Everyone,

    .......... We did our best to identify relevant sites before making the change but understand that some may have been overlooked (such as Bill).
    Sorry Jon I do not buy it and I not a member of their program but these mass actions by merchants/OPM to cut a lot of affiliates just to get ride of a few bad apples is very poor management. If you have a problem with some affiliate then remove them do not cut good affiliates because of the actions of a few bad apples.

    At the very least you could of sent out an email giving warning if you still interested in staying with BibilicaDirect and you will to follow the rules we will continue to keep you in the program, if you do not reply then we will end the relationship in 7 days. Cutting good affiliates with out any notice is unacceptable.
    MERCHANTS: Start showing your coupons directly on your site, that way your shoppers will stop leaving your site looking for them!! If not then remove your Coupon Box!!


  27. #24
    ABW Ambassador
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    Quote Originally Posted by kse View Post
    Cutting good affiliates with out any notice is unacceptable.
    I am not a member of the program but I agree that its not good practice. So you cut all and now got 2 or 3 affiliates back in the pgm after this thread. But you may have lost many more good ethical affiliates who won't bother joining back after this kind of treatment.


  28. #25
    Outsourced Program Manager
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    Hello Kse and Sam,

    Please don't misunderstand my post, I agree that providing more time would have been best. That is actually how we have handled similiar situations in the past, however we had to make tough decision in this particular case due to the nature of the brand. I will continue to make myself available for assistance on this or any other issue.
    Best Regards,

    Jon Nunez | President | AffiliateManager.com
    P: (682) 478-5882 | F: (407) 650-2820 |E: jon@affiliatemanager.com
    2013 Pinnacle Awards Affiliate Manager of the Year | LinkedIn
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