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  1. #1
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    How to trust?
    Hi!

    I'm new in the world of affiliations, but as you do to trust if the statistics are always handled by others?

    For example with Amazon, how do you track sales to be sure that Amazon will not fool with the payment of fees?

    For example HotelsCombined, how can you be certain that they are tracked all leads?

    The same with Google AdSense.

    Finally, for bookings like Booking.com, I have not yet activated, if the system use XML-API, are sure that everything is tracked properly or even Booking.com can trick us, example 10 reservations, it counts only 5?

    Let me know!

  2. #2
    Member AmericasFootprints's Avatar
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    As a newbie myself, I, too, would be interested in what people have to say about this.

  3. #3
    Affiliate Manager AffiliateWarrior's Avatar
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    This is one reason why many affiliates prefer to work with merchants through networks - having that "neutral" third party in the middle handling traffic and transaction reporting makes them feel a little better about trusting the merchant to pay them for what they drive - that said, there are merchants who are less than reputable or have excessive returns. I'd work with networks that are well trusted (I like AvantLink and ShareASale from my experience) and do some research on here and in the networks when considering a program. There are forums on here dedicated to outting scammy merchants. You can also check the Returns rate in most networks to see how many transactions merchants are cancelling. Some are legit (fraud, returned orders) but if you see a rate that is much higher than average in their industry, you may want to steer clear.

    Good luck.
    Wade Tonkin - Affiliate Manager - Fanatics
    NFLShop.com|Shop.NHL.com|NBAStore.com|Store.NASCAR.com
    Email wtonkin // at // Fanatics.com

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  5. #4
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    What does "prefer to work with merchants through networks"?

    Networks are safe?

    But even counting cancellations is in the hands of others ...

    You, AffiliateWarrior, you trust Google AdSense? Been Amazon and HotelsCombined and Booking.com?

    XML-API is secure against fraud?

  6. #5
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    I trust both AdSense and Amazon. I have been with both for over ten years (was one of the early implementers of AdSense - and have not missed a monthly check in well over 10 years). I do not "do" much with Amazon but do trust them and had my first affiliate sale with them over a dozen years ago.

    I also have been in the hospitality (hotels) vertical since March, 2000. I have tried them all (nearly). I am quite happy with Priceline and via them, the inventory at Booking (owned by Priceline). However I deal with them directly - and not through a network. The commission structure though a network is considerably lower than going direct. But, by association, I would certainly trust Booking.

    In addition (#1) - there is nothing perfectly safe against fraud. There are even some big merchants (brand names) that screw affiliates.

    In addition (#2) - notice I did not say anything about H/C.
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
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  7. #6
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    Bill, you are using some technique to be certain that you will be granted really what you do?

    If they give you commissions for 10 hotels booked, how can you be sure that your site has collected only 10 bookings and not 30?

    Same with AdSense, how to be sure that the tracking are correct, they pay you only for 10 click but should instead be 50? Is there a way to check?

    Regarding the hotels, I'd also direct affiliations and not via network. What do you use, iframe code? Using XML-API is more truthful tracking?

  8. #7
    OPM/Moderator Hectic GHC's Avatar
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    Trust us when we give you answers.
    Greg Hoffman
    Affiliate Marketing Advocate of the Year 2016; Best OPM/Agency - 2014; Best OPM/Agency, Five Years in a Row - ABestWeb.
    Visit Greg Hoffman Consulting


  9. #8
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    Yes, but if you give me some information to convince me even more...

    I think the main issue is the method of tracking, how to ensure that everything is drawn correctly.

    Or you can stand to take some money not thinking that might give you 50% of what it really you?

  10. #9
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Next year will be my 17th year in affiliate marketing.

    Doubtful you will get any additional assurances - you may just want to get out of the business and become a merchant yourself - then, you may think you have more control...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...

  11. #10
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    So the answer is that you trust and that's without being sure of the correct tracking?

  12. #11
    ...and a Pirate's heart. Convergence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harry80 View Post
    So the answer is that you trust and that's without being sure of the correct tracking?
    The answer is folks with good business acumen and years of experience have told you what 'is'. You will NEVER get the assurances you seek. Those that have spoken would not be in this industry if we didn't feel at least the majority of our relationships weren't 'working' - Hence my earlier statement...
    Salty kisses, Sandy toes, and a Pirate's heart...


  13. #12
    Pimp Duck popdawg's Avatar
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    Hi Harry
    Couple of quick things.
    First, there are no guarantees in this industry. Ever.
    Second, complete trust thrives in a lot of places. Affiliate marketing is not one of them.
    There are exceptions, but even that doesn't guarantee everything.
    There are several affiliate managers I trust, but they can only go so far with a merchant with blinders on.
    There are networks I trust more than others, but they can only go so far with merchants.
    There are people here I trust more than others, but that comes with interacting with them for years. And you've been blessed with some of their feedback in this thread already.
    But in addition to everything else, I trust in myself. I test. I track. I analyze.
    And I do this because ... there are no guarantees in this industry. Ever.
    Sound familiar?
    ================================================================
    Been away, now I'm back. Not as much, but I'm back & starting from scratch. Where I was, was fantastic. Where I am now, less so. Things have changed, become harder. So have I. Game ON!!!
    ================================================================


  14. #13
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    Not all is possible to analyze if the affiliate does not allow it... the point is this.

    For example, if a person buy a hosting that I recommended (sends me e-mail confirmation) I report the purchase to hosting, I'm sure that person bought the hosting and hosting must pay the commission. Can I have the certainty.

    Of course this is a very slow and too manual ...

    In automated mentioned, AdSense, Amazon, etc., there is no way to be certain if the numbers are true...

  15. #14
    OPM/Moderator Hectic GHC's Avatar
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    If you don't trust a little, you will never earn anything.
    Greg Hoffman
    Affiliate Marketing Advocate of the Year 2016; Best OPM/Agency - 2014; Best OPM/Agency, Five Years in a Row - ABestWeb.
    Visit Greg Hoffman Consulting

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  17. #15
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    Trust can be for friends, not in work or money!

    I do not know if you go to work months in office "hoping" that will pay you, you go to the office knowing that will pay you because you have a contract.

    The web would give us all the tools to control, without having to have trust, but since the merchant want to earn more and more on our shoulders, do not give us all access.

    I do not know if you like you tease for the work you do, you earn 10 but may also having to earn 100, but you never know because you can not track.

    It does not seem a strange doubt my.

    If you then you settle, this is another matter, but then again, why settle for earning 10 if in fact you have worked and earned 50 but I do not know?

    If I'm wrong, tell me as well, but for me, trust is not about the money.

  18. #16
    Full Member Lindy Rig's Avatar
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  20. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lindy Rig View Post
    Could you explain better? If you tell me concrete things, maybe change my mind.

  21. #18
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    Certainly, Harry. But you have had several well-experienced industry folks take time, during a VERY busy week, to respond to your questions...
    ...yet you have not yet taken time to introduce yourself to the community.
    Please start here: http://www.abestweb.com/forums/intro...bw-179732.html
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
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  22. #19
    ABW Ambassador JoyUnltd's Avatar
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    Harry,
    1. You WILL be ripped off.
    2. Some sales WILL NOT be tracked.
    3. You WILL NOT ever get all the straight answers you're seeking.
    4. You WILL be lied to, repeatedly.
    5. You MUST learn to trust, despite the dishonorable and downright stupid folks you meet in this business.

    Truth is: trust is necessary to maintain relationships with family, friends, job or ANY business endeavor. If a trust is broken, you have the choice to:
    1. Continue the relationship
    2. Modify it (only trust with certain conditions)
    3. Walk away from it

    No one can tell you exactly what to expect. One person may have a great relationship with a merchant and you may not.

    Long time ago, I had a doctor who finally gave me a correct diagnosis with a condition that I was suffering from for years, when other doctors told me I was imagining the pain and should get psychiatric help. She prescribed a different med and it cleared up within a couple of weeks. This same doctor didn't correctly diagnose a friend (& the one who referred me to her) and my friend nearly died.

    I think that before you get further involved with this business, you need an attitude change. You're asking for assurances that don't exist anywhere in life. You must proceed with living the best life you can, nonetheless.
    Renée
    Pay no attention to that woman behind the curtain. -Wizardress of Oz

  23. #20
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    Thank you, you have been clear.

    I understand that tracking all does not exist. This was the answer I wanted.

    Now I decide what to do.

    The web would give way to track, but the merchant does not want to pay the "right", but with your reasoning prefer to settle for what happens...

  24. #21
    Beachy Bill's Avatar
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    There is another way to look at your conundrum, Harry.

    The web would give way to track
    Yes, the means are available to provide all sales, click and tracking information to every affiliate.
    but the merchant does not want to pay the "right", but with your reasoning prefer to settle for what happens...
    1) There are valid reasons the merchant does not want to provide all sales, click and tracking information to every affiliate. With YOUR reasoning, see if you can figure out why merchant does not want to do this. Hint: Proprietary
    2) Even if the merchant "wanted" to provide this information, the merchant CANNOT legally do so. With YOUR reasoning, see if you can figure out why a merchant cannot legally do this. Hint: Privacy
    Bill / Marketing Blog @ 12PM - Current project: Resurrecting my "baby" at South Baltimore..
    Cute Personal Checks and Business Checks
    If you are too busy to laugh you are too busy.

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  26. #22
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    Bill, thanks again!

    I think Proprietary and Privacy have nothing to do. I say that the count should be correct when you sell, but as these data are generated by the systems of the merchant, we are certain that the count will be incorrect for not paying too many commissions. It 's just the thing.

    If a reservation at a hotel came directly to me, even the payment to me, I could forward the reservation to the merchant, so that you can establish trust with the merchant...

  27. #23
    Full Member Lindy Rig's Avatar
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    How would the merchant know that you would do that? How would the merchant have a sales relations with the client, rather than with you? Why would a client deal with you rather than the hotel directly?

  28. #24
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  29. #25
    Full Member Lindy Rig's Avatar
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    harry... it seems like affiliate marketing is not going to be a good "fit" for your business model. Why don't you just be a merchant... and set up the type of system you'd like with YOUR affiliates?

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