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  1. #1
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
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    From Today's NYTimes ...

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The diversion programs have made life difficult for affiliate marketers in the last year, said Steve Messer, chief executive of LinkShare, a company that runs a major affiliate network. But he sees a silver lining. "It's showed affiliate marketing has come of age," Mr. Messer said. "If you look at it, the volume of transactions passing through LinkShare's affiliate marketing got so big that when affiliates get upset, the largest merchants in the world react. If it's just a few dollars, nobody would've noticed."

    LinkShare is working with other companies in their market to come up with industry standards to govern ethical practices in online advertising, Mr. Messer said. "For some people, WWW stands for the Wild, Wild West," he said. "Hopefully, that's coming to an end."
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Read the complete Article HERE

    <font size="2" face="Verdana">Haiko


    The secret of success is constancy of purpose. ~ Disraeli
    </font></p>

  2. #2
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    Linkshare just blew past CJ, in my opinion. The turtle's spinning in his shell as the Rabbit sprints past.

    If you try to please everybody, someone won't like it -Rumsfeld

  3. #3
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    I love Linkshare [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    Sal @ PHATBargains.com

  4. #4
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    Way to go Linkshare!!!

    thank you!!

    Vicki [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

    she was tired of being poor, and she wasn't into selling door to door.... CSN

  5. #5
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    Now if only Linkshare could do aggregate commissions, they'd be pounding a certain two-letter affiliate network into the ground!

    (Don't get me wrong, their stance on parasiteware is VERY commendable - but they have other problems)

  6. #6
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    Yup, even without the consolidated payments, LS is looking like the best business decision an affiliate can make.

    {

    Try me.

  7. #7
    ABW Ambassador
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    Way to go Steven! That was one of the best and most subtle sales pitches I have ever seen in an interview!

    -Wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  8. #8
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Wayne Porter- AffTrack:
    Way to go Steven! That was one of the best and most subtle sales pitches I have ever seen in an interview!

    -Wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


    Hmmm ... and you expect us to believe you're not making one?

    {
    Try me.

  9. #9
    ABW Ambassador Packy's Avatar
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    WTG LinkShare,

    Lead the way and show the others that the little guys and gals do matter and do make a difference! You will leave the others in the dust holding a strong stance agaisnt Parasites! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

    Affiliate Programs That Kick Major Butt

  10. #10
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    It's nice to see one CEO of a major network take a stance against the hijackers. It's been a long time since me and others last year begged the CEO's to clean up their act. Stephen Messer was then, and now, putting into action what he felt in his heart. Linkshare unlike CJ seems to be ashamed of their having to take a cut on parasitewarez sales activity and you can bet LS affiliates will be looking for those merchants who aren't on Morpheus -LimeWire- Kazaa -ShopNow?Whenu.com lists.

    I know Scott at Befree missed a chance for promoting their stance and policy statement, but more articles and media coverage might come as the news hounds follow the evasive drifts and sniff under the covers for the sources of the stink.

    WebMaster Mike

  11. #11
    ABW Ambassador
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    EagleFire,

    I was very sincere in congratulating Steven. It was slick handling in a potentially loaded situation.

    Of course you will note that Steven never comments on the issue, never takes a stand, and turns the quote into a great sales pitch for Linkshare. The NY Times prints it so I am amazed. As for me and sales pitches, yes of course, that's what a productive business person does. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    The Quote:

    "The diversion programs have made life difficult for affiliate marketers in the last year, said Steve Messer, chief executive of LinkShare, a company that runs a major affiliate network. But he sees a silver lining. "It's showed affiliate marketing has come of age," Mr. Messer said. "If you look at it, the volume of transactions passing through LinkShare's affiliate marketing got so big that when affiliates get upset, the largest merchants in the world react. If it's just a few dollars, nobody would've noticed."

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  12. #12
    Member mrmerchant's Avatar
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    Well stated, Wayne. I agree. Messer had a big chance to talk to the world via the NY Times and what did he have to say? "Our mass of little affiliates are really worth something - really, they are." Come now! Never mind the fact that Andy's quote was saying just the opposite - that merchants react when an affiliate takes a piece of every transaction... not transactions that others delivered. They could not care any less about that. Once again, our media at its best. If it ain't Iraq it's Linkshare!!!

  13. #13
    Affiliate Network Rep
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    Wayne and all: I talked extensively with the NY times reporter about the issues that these parasiteware technologies present. I also discussed at great length LinkShare's aggressive stance, as the industry leader, in trying to create a standard that protects affiliates from theft. While I would have loved to see all those discussions quoted in the article I did not have the authorship control or editing rights. The New York Times, for what ever reason, does not like their reporters to be influenced in that way. Good for them.

    As everyone here knows LinkShare is and has been the only network to take a real stance on this area. What many of you don't know is how difficult this has been.

    For over 8 months we have stood alone in the affiliate world pushing best practices and getting results. With the support of our merchants who agree with our stance we have taken the revenue hit to protect our affiliate partners. This affects not only our revenue but that of our merchant. No other network or network of merchants has been willing to do this.

    Our actions have been clear, coordinated and aggressive. While we have a long way to go to eliminate this problem (which will not happen over night) we seem to be the only ones trying to do something about it. LinkShare has made offers to all the other networks to give them our standard (and work with them on enforcement) which where developed with people like Haiko and others that solves this problem, but to this day no one has taken us up on it. We do not care who gets credit for the standard only that it is universal making it possible to police these groups in a realistic fashion. It would help us out tremendously if the other networks worked with us to make this a standard, then for us to go it alone, but we continue to work hard for you.

    So while you characterize my quote as a sales pitch I do take offense to that characterization. Look at what we have done and what we continue to do as the sole lone ranger on the Internet. Finally, if all I cared about was press, I would have given a quote that got me above the fold not in the last paragraph ;-)

    Six years ago LinkShare created the Affiliate Network Industry. At that time everyone called us crazy for trying to create something that did not exist, but all our work has paid off. Our Network has grown thanks to you all and to our great merchants and with all of our hard work we have not only made affiliate marketing real but a huge and growing industry. Forgive me if I am the only one who is not sitting back and watching anyone destroy this dream.
    Best regards,
    Stephen
    (If you want to help, then push the other providers to get on board with our standard. In the meantime, anything you all could do to increase sales to LinkShare merchants would be a start to helping us offset the lose of this revenue.)

  14. #14
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    Steve,

    Is Morpheus an affiliate member of Linkshare Network? Is Gator? is WhenU / TopMoxie?

    What is the nature of the stance you have taken? Will you mind when I steal from your merchants and give it to the ones I choose?

    Murat Ates
    Affiliate Marketing Professional

    ---------------
    "Seat Belts - Click it or Ticket" ~Garden State Parkway

  15. #15
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    Steven,

    In all fairness, having been quoted in the past, I know how easily the media twists words, misquotes and use that they want from what can be a lenthy interaction. Therefore I extend my formal apology Steven. I simply assumed you could control the N.Y. Times. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    That being said, the quote came off to me as saying nothing substantial about the issue at hand. What is LS's official stance??

    I agree that it would be in the markets best interests to get major networks, thought shapers, and analysts to come together to come up with some
    guidelines.

    I hear a lot of different and emphatic voices, but few evaluating the impact from everyone's side (network, merchant, affiliate and end user).

    regards,
    Wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  16. #16
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    &gt;I hear a lot of different and emphatic voices, but few evaluating the impact from everyone's side (network, merchant, affiliate and end user).


    Wayne,

    As much as I agree that the issue is a complex one to resolve, it is no more complex than the following scenario:

    A man steals another man's wallet. He gets caught and they go to court. The theif is the Judge's son, There are no jury on duty and the victim's advocate has no consent from the victim.

    The only reasonable outcome from this scenario is, the victim steals the wallets of the judge and the thief right in the scene and runs away.

    Or we will wait until Todd Crawford "resolves" the issue discussing with Haiko de Poel Jr. and Kirk Feathers and lets us know.

    Murat Ates
    Affiliate Marketing Professional

    ---------------
    "Seat Belts - Click it or Ticket" ~Garden State Parkway

  17. #17
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    Murat,

    For the sake of clarity I would like to see "official" responses from the networks regarding the issues- on their corporate web addresses. Message boards are great places to discuss, but the time is approaching to see action.

    At this point it is unclear to me how the various networks deal with this type of operation. For that matter, we have a number of working ideas on what constitutes a parasitic application and what does not. (i.e. is Alexa parasitic with it's amazon.com button) Not to mention that new technology will surely surprise us with that it can do.

    There should be a unified front here to address the issue. I see it as pivotal because if not addressed by the industry as a whole it opens up a Pandora's Box of problems.

    best,

    Wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  18. #18
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
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    Linkshare has for 8 months taken a completely proactive stance on parasiteware and everyone knows it, parasites, merchants and affiliates!

    Stephen is willing to come to the table with open arms so that we all can earn more by creating an industry wide standard for affiliates to adhere to and when it gets done ... and it will! then we can continue in our never-ending successes as affiliates and merchants.

    =========

    Murat,

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Or we will wait until Todd Crawford "resolves" the issue discussing with Haiko de Poel Jr. and Kirk Feathers and lets us know.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Sometimes I really wonder about your impetus! Things are happening, now either get on board and lets all work together to bring about change, or sit and watch it.

    <font size="2" face="Verdana">Haiko


    The secret of success is constancy of purpose. ~ Disraeli
    </font></p>

  19. #19
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    &gt;There should be a unified front here to address the issue. I see it as pivotal because if not addressed by the industry as a whole it opens up a Pandora's Box of problems.


    Agree. We have already seen some of us (Tim from FatWallet) has choosen to be competitive in Today's affiliate marketing arena. The reality is, I know a few others who are competing with me to get the "product stealing" thing out there. It is UGLY already with the setup of affiliate networks and the industry as a whole that disadvantages pure-play affiliate marketers. It will get even uglier if "taskbar marketing" is accepted to be a player in the industry.

    I hope we will accomplish to take this big step to STOP ME!

    best,

    Murat Ates
    Affiliate Marketing Professional

    ---------------
    "Seat Belts - Click it or Ticket" ~Garden State Parkway

  20. #20
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    Haiko,

    I will agree that Linkshare has been proactive, for that matter they have been far more proactive and responsive compared to the Linkshare of two years ago. I commend them for this and it has been good for their business.

    However, I feel the affiliate community at large wants *specifics* from all of their providers. I also feel the community wants a concerted and conjoined effort from networks to resolve the issue. That way everyone can get back to focusing on sales and generating business.



    -wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  21. #21
    ABW Ambassador BareNecessities's Avatar
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    Here is my wishful thinking.

    I would like the networks to lay down the law. No downloadable applications will be allowed by their partners.

    Period.

    If the consumer wants a reminder to shop somewhere, they should set their homepage to the shopping site of their choice.

    Period.

    Once someone leaves that homepage shopping site, they are fair game for the best affiliate marketer/salesman out there. Whoever can convince the consumer to go to Site X and buy product Y, then that person/site gets the commission.

    Period.

    No reminders. No helpful hints. No choices to change your mind and go to another site.

    Period.

    Just my wishful thinking.

    Michael
    973-621-6211 x 5040
    michael(at)barenecessities.com

  22. #22
    ABW Ambassador
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    Murat,

    Your killing me over here.... LOL.

    -wayne

    Wayne Porter
    V.P. Product Development
    AffTrack LLC.
    http://www.afftrack.com
    http://www.revtrends.com
    Advanced & Automated Data Analysis for Performance Marketers.

  23. #23
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    &gt;Your killing me over here.... LOL.

    Only trying to be an agressive and a competitive marketer, that's all. Sometimes trends drive the market, but most of the time, market drives the trends.

    As much as I would like to stay as an ethical, pure play marketer, being smart and competitive wouldn't hurt anyone.

    Murat Ates
    Affiliate Marketing Professional

    ---------------
    "Seat Belts - Click it or Ticket" ~Garden State Parkway

  24. #24
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Michael of BareNecessities;

    I'm going to pull down all my under garment merchants from all my Cybermalls and give you an exclusive. No leakage going to any of your competitors. I suggest other ABWers to do the same. Michaels statement makes it real simple for the networks to place one sentence into their TOS. Commissionable traffic comes from the domain of the affiliate...only! If the dupers or parasites can't generate or pay for traffic to their sites ..tough luck.

    WebMaster Mike

  25. #25
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    &gt;Just my wishful thinking.


    Michael,

    Wake up... would you like silk boxers with that wishful thinking, sir?.. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]. I think Wayne would have said "that is what I was thinking before I knew money existed"... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] , right, Wayne?

    Murat Ates
    Affiliate Marketing Professional

    ---------------
    "Seat Belts - Click it or Ticket" ~Garden State Parkway

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