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  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador buy_online's Avatar
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    My question first, then the who,what,where when. If one's domain(s)/IP's are black-holed for email connected SPAM, does this affect SE placement?

    Here's why I ask - Was checking a couple of spammers and their domains this evening, when I decided to put some of my own domains in.Sam Spade Tools Well low and behold, one of the IP's I use was listed! Now it's not because I am a spammer, but because my "Honest" big web host supports spammers, and a couple of porn sites. In this case it's Ntt/Verio.

    Here is my reason for asking this question at the SE forum. You see, I found out the details about this by tracking this all back to a discussion at GOOGLE groups! By this time, all the red lights on my dashboard (so to speak) were lit up.

    It seems all IP's at Verio have been blocked out by one guy alone. Their big-business "Who cares" attitude pissed him off - can't say as I blame him.

    I have an easy fix for the problem, I'll be moving the sites off VERIO next week. But the question remains concerning the domain/IP. Is it a factor? Anyone care to venture an answer would be helpful.

    Thank you,

    Fred
    :mad: :confused:
    [edited the title of the post for spelling - it was late!]

    [ 08-10-2002: Message edited by: buy_online ]

  2. #2
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    Hi Fred.

    I'm not 100% on this, but I think I remember a couple of threads on this where the general consensus was: No, it doesn't matter, or doesn't appear to matter, but move host just in case!

    I'm really not certain but FWIW there is my take on it [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

    Nick

  3. #3
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    Verio was hardly blocked by one guy alone. They have blocks blackholed on every single spam check. They just don't care. If I was a betting man, I would give them a year before they go under. Allowing spammers is always an act of desperation.

    Chet

  4. #4
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    I was reading in this month's PC World about spammers (good article.. it might be *last* months issue in the US since it's an import to the UK). It seems that the worst offender for allowing spammers is... WorldCom!

    Being on a spammy host won't impact your SE placement though.. it may impact on any emails that originate from their mail servers if they're blocklisted.

  5. #5
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    There's two issues here - SE spam and email spam. If you are on the same IP as an email spammer, it isn't going to affect your search engine placement at all.

    If you are on the same IP as a search engine spammer, it used to be enough to get you banned. However, the big search engines don't ban by IP anymore, although I saw that Inktomi spam list that became available some while ago and the inference I drew from some of the entries was that they kept a closer eye on domains originating from certain IPs.

    My conclusion: you will be OK even if you share an IP will a known search engine spammer, except in Gigablast and a couple of the smaller SEs that still ban by IP.

  6. #6
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    How do the search engines ban if not by IP? Note: we don't spam! But I thought that's how you got banned, by IP address.

  7. #7
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Over the last 14 months all R&D and add-ons to the major affiliate networks were funded to promote/automate the Duperaffiliates -parasites and scumware operators. The result of these gorilla marketers abuses is now millions have installed Ad blocking software that automatically block links from BeFree -CJ and Linkshare and the others. Everyday thousands more of our shoppers install Ad blocking software impacting our ability to earn commissions and generate clicks.

    Now that the networks, through the Eyeball monsters, have branched out into network supported e-mail marketers sending out billions of opt-out spamms they face getting all commercial e-mail blocked that contain affiliate coded links. People do not want to have Ads via portal sites or e-mails shoved in front of their faces 24/7. They will choose to shop on their own time frame not the desperate merchants time frame. It is a fact that at any given moment less than 1% of the online world gives a crap about your brand -your shopping site -your products or your coupon and incent offers. Same goes in the real world as cars pass by your storefront location, billboards and the mind ignors TV commercials and Ad print in newspapers. They shop when & where they choose and soon the consumer get's feed up with online Advertising trickery and just installs a Ad blocker for both their browser and e-mail program.

    I guess I'll have to get completely upfront with my shoppers by calling some prominent merchants basically a complete waste of their time. Basically redue my Cybermalls approach of pointing shoppers to a variety of merchants. The merchants that scrape visitor's personal info and e-mail addresses, rather than offer real deals on quality merchandise from my links, will get exposed in my Merchant alerts. I'll earn the savvy shoppers trust, bookmark and loyality to my merchant choices, because they will not get the sleezebag gorilla marketers from clicking on one of my merchant links. Any merchant listed on a parasite program or opt-out e-mail marketers list get's blacklisted and exposed.

    I'll blast the branders -Freebee adwarez virus downloaders -the spammer frontend Dupers, MLMers and those waste of time lead merchants who bury their real agenda under text spin drool. My honesty will overcome, thru a shopper "shock treatment", the eyeball factory approach and earn me bookmarks that overcome all SE weaknesses and rule changes and PPC merchant trademark restrictions.

    If a merchant I display links for cannot show sales from my shoppers clicks then I'll rate them on my "savvy shopper" consumer satisfaction scale. MY shoppers vote with their network reported purchases. This will take some major restructuring from my current scattergun approach. I'll have to disclose the diversion tactics used by merchant's who are basically trustworthy, even if over-priced, informing my shoppers NOT TO fall for these non-commissionable actions. I'll also warn them not to signup for shared e-mail address blasts on their visit, if the merchant sells off or cross partners their list. Personally I'll signup with my merchant choices for their e-mail program to check for abusers. I'll solicate feedback from shoppers who get positive/negative feedback from my merchant selections or those alternatives they recommend and post this for all to see. I intend to add value to my shoppers clicks through outlining where the real buys are located at each merchant site and where they are better off shopping local stores for a better or equal price and return policy services. The categories that have no outstanding merchants, but get traffic, will get a monitized search box along with honest warnings that this section is full of snake oil salesmen with links to shopper alert sections. I'll also add in some e-commerce newsflashes and links to things like Lavasoft's Adaware program, and parasite/e-mail marketing schemes with cures or alternatives. If my shoppers appreciate my honest approach they will reward me with a bookmark or referral and shop my merchant selections. Hell ..I'll even throw in some non affiliate "new window" links to merchants with great sites and no program who my shoppers recommend.

  8. #8
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>How do the search engines ban if not by IP?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    By domain name.

    WebmasterMike,

    Did you actually read any of this thread before you started yet another rant. No, thought not.

  9. #9
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Did you actually read any of this thread before you started yet another rant. No, thought not.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Right post, wrong place.

    The 'scattergun' approach. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

  10. #10
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Getting banned by the SE's or getting banned by e-mail filtering programs for spamming or being falsely labeled a spammer by IP association with an abuser was the issue. Getting labeled and then booted by your hosting company for spam complaints due to some formmail security hole might result in your hosting company also getting Black-listed in a host file. Guilt by association with spammers affecting your livelyhood is the subject. Signing up, promoting with an affiliate link or paying someone like Trafficmagnet or some SE optomizer submittal wank can easily ruin your reputation and put you on some Banned list.

    Well MarkyMark the largest monitizers that get webmaster/siteowners banned from PPC keyword listings and have the rules changed within the SE to penalize affiliate linked sites are the very networks who support/promote the abusers. The spammers seeking a quick buck lay hidden underneith hundreds of affiliate enabled merchant/DuperAffiliate sites at these networks. This activity that requires developing Blacklists -banned sites and IP's for both SE and e-mail spamming was brought on by so called merchants hosted on the affiliate networks.

    Your expertise in SE operations is unquestioned. Your ability to combat the spammers and how SE's are forced to react to their quest for listing loopholes is a hopeless task. The rules change monthly as SE's move to preference merchant only paid listings due to affiliate abuses since they seem to have sustainable budgets. ISP's and hosting companies are drained of resources by spammers. They'll drop an account in a heartbeat, even wrongfully, due to their need to plug holes in their bandwidth dam. The gorrila marketers hiding within the networks bypass the SE exclusions,rules by hijacking other peoples traffic rather than worry about SE positioning. They also are destroying affiliate conversion ratios while making merchants demand top position listings. These same gorillas will bring about black listing legit e-mail marketers as the surfing public demands e-mail servers that filter out ALL advertising they didn't double opt-in to receive. This post is about how to keep from getting banned from SE's -ISP's and hosting companies due to getting associated with spamming activities. My response is you'll always be in jeopardy as long as the networks foster programs that breed and filter new e-mail addresses down to the spamm farmers. Til then look for more blocked .host lists IP and domain blacklists to filter out all forms of advertising at the ISP/hosting level just like they do at the fortune 1000 companies.

    We'll only be able to combat this by designing our sites to earn a bookmark which is more valuable than a shifting costly SE listing or e-mail campaign that ends up in a trash bin like direct mail.

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