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  1. #1
    Full Member SpikeDo's Avatar
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    As you all know well, it's really getting harder to get reciprocal links these days. Webmasters seem to be getting pickier (can't blame them). So I was thinking. I have a group of aff sites now that are different, yet in some sense could be viewed as complimentary. Would it make sense, from a PR and traffic point of view, to (1) exchange links with my own sites and (2) put links to all my sites on every page of every site? I've seen some ABW members do these with their sites. What really are the pros and cons. Would anyone care to opine? Thanks.

  2. #2
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    That's a very dangerous thing to do, and the sort of thing that will get a Google penalty on all your sites. Excessive cross-linking is one thing that Google hates.

    However, if you have some sites with "natural" PageRank - that is PageRank gained by people linking into you, your outbound links should still give PageRank to your other site. But keep the links flowing in one direction as much as possible.

    ________
    "All your commission are belong to us." - Slimeware Corporation

  3. #3
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    Are you using subdomains? I'm not a computer geek, but my partner is. She's a bit of a genius in this area, and I'll tell you what she has told me.

    Google considers subdomains (a spin off from domains) as domains, so, that being the case, you can link your sites together.

    Still in doubt??? How about all those ads in a site? Those ads goes to other sites, right? It's the same as you linking your sites together. A link is a link.

    It's just common sense, isn't it?

    But, if you have your doubts, as you should, being that this is a message board, and you don't know who is doing the posting, contact Google about it. Just simply ask them if they consider subdomains as domains. That is, if that is what you are talking about.

    As for #2, don't risk it. It's better safe than sorry.

    [This message was edited by NoBody on January 17, 2004 at 06:00 PM.]

  4. #4
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    I dunno. I have a bunch of subdomains and I link them all together. So far, so good.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!
    Affiliates, before you use CJ merchants, Read This! Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  5. #5
    Just Lurking
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    Be careful if you have duplicate content, cross linking maybe a real PR killer in such a case. It seems best to link index to index and deep link only where it seems natural. It's not a good idea to cross link every page. If you don't over do it you should be fine. Err on the side of caution.

    ------------------------------
    "If all the newbies are going to start writing ebooks maybe I should get started on mine!" -- Buddha

  6. #6
    ABW Ambassador buy_online's Avatar
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    Cross linking different sites is a great idea! What difference will it make if you own the domain or someone else? That's the beauty of it, you have control.

    To be more specific, I am not talking about linking "auto.yourdomain.com" with "clothing.yourdomain.com" But if you linked two sites you own like this "globfly.com" with "barfnvomit.com" that's cool.

    As for being careful - you betcha. If you have links to JC Whitney at both globfly.com and barfnvomit.com (especially data feed) then you are looking trouble (so to speak).

    It's all about originality. How much originality do you build into your site(s)?

    Fred

    Are you sure the nurses know you're using the computer?

  7. #7
    Full Member SpikeDo's Avatar
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    Well, here's what I'm talking about. Say, for example (and it is), I have a candle site. And I also have a gift baskets site. Using common sense, I think visitors would also be shoppers for gift baskets. So if they didn't want to buy a candle today, perhaps they might be interested in a gift basket. Seeing my gift basket site link at the bottom of the candle site pages, they click.

    I see two good things here. One, it prevents someone from going out to Google for gift baskets (if they were interested in one) and looking up the competition. Two, they may be at the candle site looking for candles but, hey, they see the gift basket link and think, yeah I have someone I need to shop for a gift for. And third, if both sites are at least a pr4, they both get an extra link counted toward higher pr. Am I just daft or making sense?

  8. #8
    Full Member SpikeDo's Avatar
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    I think you're right buy_online. These are totally unique sites, with different content and different affiliate links. Yet they are complimentary like the example above.

    What I'm thinking is to create a kind of mini-mall footer at the bottom of every page with links to every aff site I own. I've seen this done sometimes even in a header. The ideal situation would be your visitor going from one of your sites to the next, making order after order.

    I just worry about getting penalized by the SEs for some reason.

  9. #9
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Be careful if you have duplicate content <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I have some similar content but the navigation is different, the titles are different, the meta tags are different, the images on the page may look the same but, they have differnt names and alt tags, the keywords are different, the headings and subheadings are different.

    To be safe, I guess, I could add some silly thing to the link names, like adding "RING: name" on one stite and just leaving it at "name" on another site.

    So, I guess, that is about all. The search engines read pages of totally different "size". I hope that covers me.

    Mr.Merchant, if you do business in any way what-so-ever with parasites, your products will not be sold on my sites!!
    Affiliates, before you use CJ merchants, Read This! Comments are to be interpreted as opinion unless otherwise noted.

  10. #10
    ABW Ambassador buy_online's Avatar
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    "Seeing my gift basket site link at the bottom of the candle site pages, they click."

    Why not have that link up near the top of those pages

    Fred

    Are you sure the nurses know you're using the computer?

  11. #11
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Would it make sense, from a PR and traffic point of view, to (1) exchange links with my own sites and <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It makes sense.

    Some specifics:

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> put links to all my sites on every page of every site? I've seen some ABW members do these with their sites.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I wouldn't put ALL my sites on every other site... Also if you have a decent amount of pages to link to, you'll end up with a HUGE SSI file. So there's a limit to how many links can be crammed on a page, at least if you don't want it to take 5 minutes to download!

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Say, for example (and it is), I have a candle site. And I also have a gift baskets site. Using common sense, I think visitors would also be shoppers for gift baskets. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I agree. Sometimes I link my similar stuff together whether it's on the same site or not. Strangely, what usually happens is that one of the sites (or pages) will end up ranked higher than the other.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>And third, if both sites are at least a pr4, they both get an extra link counted toward higher pr. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    That usually works. Don't ask me why it's "usually" and not always! But I've had links where the PR passed on, and others where the bot picked up the link but the target got no PR out of it--from similar linking situations.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Why not have that link up near the _top_ of those pages ~BuyOnline<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Do you get good results that way? I thought that may interfere with selling what's actually on the page...

    It's the most wonderful time of the year!~Old Christmas Song

  12. #12
    ABW Ambassador Steveinid's Avatar
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    something I have read on here before says that linking all your sites together is not a bad thing if kept to a minimum... BUT, Google is also aware of what server these sites are on. So, if you have all those sites linked together and on the same server (or by the same hosting company I'm guessing) then google sees that and takes it into account. You may think, hey, a link is a link but if on the same server then your link to your other sites are more than just a link.

    I have read this but have no knowledge if this is true or not.

    "Bueller...? Bueller...?"

  13. #13
    ABW Ambassador
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    In short, do 1, but not 2.
    Note: Do not crosslink your sites on all pages!

  14. #14
    Full Member SpikeDo's Avatar
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    Why Irma? Please explain.

  15. #15
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    Some of my sites are linked together, and I've never seen any sort of "penalty" by Google. The links and traffic can be very beneficial when starting a new site.

    Keep the user in mind with everything you do. Would links to your other sites be useful to visitors to your site? If so, add them. If not, don't.

    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com

  16. #16
    Sgt. Joe Friday frank3iii's Avatar
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    How about treating your related sites like a 'web ring'?

    Frank

    "Just the facts, Ma'am"
    Sgt. Joe Friday, Dragnet

  17. #17
    Action Jackson - King of the World
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    At the bottom of my sites I have a Visit Our Other Sites

    Are you saying this is bad?

    Could this be why Google lost 20k worth of pages?

    Jack Mitchell
    http://kattskozykorner.com
    http://clothing-to-go.com
    http://sports-to-go.com

  18. #18
    ABW Ambassador ktmkiddy's Avatar
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    Hi Jack,

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> At the bottom of my sites I have a Visit Our Other Sites

    Are you saying this is bad?
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    I do the same..."this site was designed by www.abcblahblah.com" at the bottom of each page.

    A simple link...but as it's on a shared border it occurs on over 250 pages..so far google PR is in top 5 for most pages...so i'm not so sure Jack.

    But I am getting major traffic from Yahoo and MSN these days.


    Malc

  19. #19
    ABW Ambassador buy_online's Avatar
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    "Do you get good results that way? I thought that may interfere with selling what's actually on the page..."

    My point was to get attention to the link (if that was the priority). If I know a particular page is getting attention regularly from the spider, I will always put a link there (at least for a little while) to any new site(s) I may have launched.

    Again, if this is a priority, it's near the top of the code (uh...I mean page ) Since it is not a network style (LS, BF, CJ) link, just a domain name, I haven't seen it treated negatively at all. I might even put the link in a smaller font, so as not to distract from a real human visitor's experience. For example: "Try blahblah.com for well designed glob in three different colors" I do not try to change the color, or try to hide it - IMHO cheating.

    Again, short story is that when it is important to be noticed, it's near the top.

    Fred

    Are you sure the nurses know you're using the computer?

  20. #20
    ABW Ambassador
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    About a year and a half ago I had all my sites crosslinked. When one got penalized, every single one was soon PR=0.

    A year later, the main site was unpenalized. I then realized that I didn't need the cross-linking, and frankly I really don't even need the other sites.

    Your best bet is to get a few really significant inbound links. It is hard, but better than setting up a lot of stupid little sites on your own.

    You might see some sites ranked highly that do this schemeyou are talking about, but just remember that there are many many others that you no longer see because of the penalties.

  21. #21
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    The linking has to "look natural". So, the occassional crosslink between sites looks quite normal. Having a link or two on every page is also normal.

    When it becomes abnormal, maybe a little like what happened to Jimbo, is when you have an excessive number of crosslinks between sites.

    So, if you have twenty sites, and all twenty sites are linked in from every page on all of those twenty sites, then that's the sort of thing Google notices and penalises you for. They have algorithms sifting their data looking for that kind of manipulation.

    Why is it manipulation? Well, let's say that you have one site with a typical PageRank of 5. You could use outbound links from those pages to add PageRank to a series of other sites, giving them something in the PR 3-4 range. This is all well and good, and because Google has given you privilege of a PageRank "vote" this is pretty normal.. PageRank is flowing in one direction..

    ..however, if you then link back from those sites to your original site, you are creating potentially several hundred backlinks to your original site, which theoretically would boost the PageRank of the first site, which would then attempt to pass it back to the other secondary sites, and so on. In other words, you're creating a major feedback loop of PageRank and you'll end up with a big fat PR of zero.

    Look at it this way.. anything you do on your site has to stand up to scrutiny by the Google anti-spam algorithms, plus your competitors and Google staff.

    ________
    "All your commission are belong to us." - Slimeware Corporation

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