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  1. #1
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    Great news, so far this month I have made just over $2.50 from CJ merchants...I even got a nickel from eBay...I'm thrilled to no end.

    Geez Louise...500 super targetted clicks from 9,000 impressions...a slightly more than 1/2 a cent per click thru.

    WOW the CJ merchants must be overjoyed with the money I am bringing them. Todd will be able to take another expensive 3 week vacation by next year for sure.

    But wait there's more...the impressions and click thrus are down 90%.

    So how am I getting rich? ADSENSE and Shareasale.

    Just replace CJ merchants with SAS ones put Adsense on the same pages and buy all the 2 cent per click traffic you can buy...and go to the bank.

    And one other thing...Valueclick stock options.
    The SO wrote a 100 in the money call options on VC when they finalized the CJ deal...they all expired worthless, we are in hog heaven and I get a free vacation to Jersey for the summer.

    Thanks CJ.

    Oh he says eBay and Overstock are next...but a bit riskier...fraud always shows up in the bottom line of public companies sooner or later.

    Who says you can't make money online....

  2. #2
    ABW Ambassador mailman's Avatar
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    It's totally crazy what is happening.I believe those members that have good producing sites should do something like this.
    Merchants.Our minimal charge is $5.00 per month for either a banner ad or text ad. Should the commissions excede the $5.00 we will wave the monthly charge.This might correct those merchants who don't have any intention of ever paying.

  3. #3
    ABW Ambassador ToughTurkey's Avatar
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    Great, another CJ bashing thread.
    Everyones experience seems to be different. My tax year runs June to June, and with 2 weeks left I am within striking distance of 6 figures. Over half of that comes from CJ, and I am very happy with them.
    quote:
    So how am I getting rich? ADSENSE and Shareasale.

    I've earned a total of $2 from Sharesale this year, and as for Adsense - Dont get me wrong, I am a fan of Adsense, I get a healthy cheque each month from them - but buying traffic for $.02 and selling it for $.05 is a hard way to make money. And unless you get a million visitors a day you aint going to get rich by doing it.

  4. #4
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
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    Tough Turkey - I like the avatar!

    You are right - pick the right merchants (like some featured on this site) and bring in lots of targeted traffic. I am at about $7EPC (ave) but there are a lot of merchants at CJ that produce ZERO for me for whatever reason - I will be cleaning house soon!
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  5. #5
    Affiliate Miester my2cents's Avatar
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    JJ i appears you have the traffic but are sending it to mercants that dont convert...

    this is more of a mercant problem then a cj problem...

    while cj does have tracking issues,, it up to the merchant to see that all sales by affilaites are tracked so these affilliates are paid for their work...

    it like Cheesehead says... pick some ABW Merchants and you will be less likely to have problems..


    Joe
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    that's my2cents, 'cuz I'm a legend in my own mind....

  6. #6
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
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    Hi Rich!

    If it's all the same to you I'll keep my name. I'm kinda used to it.

    BTW, what my2cents said is true. You have to find the right merchants to make a buck at CJ. Right merchants for your sites, and merchants who convert the customers you bring them.

  7. #7
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    CJ merchants are funny... or maybe it's just CJ.

    One of my CJ merchants got about 200 clicks with 0 sale. I emailed the AM to see if there was anything I could do to get at least ONE sale. They replied, your links are all good, just keep sending traffic, sales will come. Really? Hummm... I'm used to better conversions than that.

    So I decided to do a little test. I found another merchant with the SAME PRODUCTS but slightly higher prices and a smaller selection. The NEXT day after I added this new merchant I got a sale with less than 50 clicks.

    Coincidence?

    I also have a CJ merchant that I just love! I can't find as good a selection or better prices with other merchants anywhere else. I made one sale with them that gave me a total of $12 commission. It's a good thing that I'm not in the US or they don't deliver in Canada because I would spend most of my commissions with them! I will keep this one for a while and see how it goes. I wish they would move to Shareasale.

    I get daily sales with Shareasale and other in-house programs and/or networks. CJ seems to be hit and miss for me with twice as many merchants and a lot more hits than any of the others and less sales. I am in the process of replacing several CJ merchants that don't convert and it's too early yet to get accurate stats. Time will tell.

    Trust had ONE thing right yesterday. Affiliates DO have a choice. Although many problems are not OUR fault, we can do something about it. I chose to move my traffic to a more reliable and stable environment.

    Catwoman

  8. #8
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
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    quote:
    Trust had ONE thing right yesterday.~Catwoman


    IMO Trust was right on the money on his main points yesterday, but the thread was closed before I got my dittos in.

    quote:
    buying traffic for $.02 and selling it for $.05 is a hard way to make money. And unless you get a million visitors a day you aint going to get rich by doing it. ~ToughTurkey


    Yeah, 3c/click net, that's discouraging just to think about...
    There is no knowledge that is not power. ~Hemingway

  9. #9
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    This is really not a hard concept. Find merchants that convert for you. I see some posts with people that keep sending hundreds/thousands of clicks without a sale. Find a converting merchant. The thing you want to look at is EPC, your EPC with the merchant. Take some time with the merchants you currently have and find how much you are earning PER CLICK and the ones that are bringing in the most PUSH THEM MORE. I throw just about everybody up and try them out for myself, i could care less how they're working for everybody else. Your EPC or the networks EPC of a merchant means nothing to me. The ones i push are the ones with the better EPC and the ones that convert month in, month out. Those are the ones you want to be sending your traffic too. Also probably good to lose this network merchant thing. Labeling merchants as CJ merchants or LS merchants etc. Just think merchant. There are good ones in every network. There are some in every network i've had no luck with. There are some in every network i do great with. I could care less what network they're with, they all have their + and - in the end, if they convert for me and pay i'm

  10. #10
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
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    Gotta ditto Carwoman. Same experience here.
    Comments are opinion unless otherwise noted. Remember, pillage first. Then burn. Half of all people in the world have IQs under 100. You best learn to trust ol' SSanf!

  11. #11
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    There are so many things to take into consideration when deciding if you should stop promoting a merchant.
    Just because they don't convert after 200 clicks it doesn't mean that there is a network problem.

    It depends on how you are pushing the merchant. If affiliate A is getting a sale in every 50 clicks, and affiliate B is getting a sale after 200 clicks, is it a network problem? a merchant problem? Or is it an affiliate problem?

    Anyone can slap a few links on a page. How many clicks it takes to get a sale is dependant upon how you promote the merchant, combined with where you send the visitor on the merchant site, combined with how targeted the visitor is in the first place.

    "One of my CJ merchants got about 200 clicks with 0 sale. I emailed the AM to see if there was anything I could do to get at least ONE sale. They replied, your links are all good, just keep sending traffic, sales will come. Really? Hummm... I'm used to better conversions than that.

    So I decided to do a little test. I found another merchant with the SAME PRODUCTS but slightly higher prices and a smaller selection. The NEXT day after I added this new merchant I got a sale with less than 50 clicks"

    Maybe this is to do with the banner or text link? Was the wording of the text link identical in both instances?

    With better wording in the text link, maybe the visitors were more targeted?

    One sale is not much of a test anyway, it could have been a coincidence.

    Just because a merchant doesn't convert for you, it doesn't mean that there is a network or a merchant problem. It might very well be how the affiliate is promoting the merchant

  12. #12
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    quote:
    but buying traffic for $.02 and selling it for $.05 is a hard way to make money. ~ ToughTurkey™

    Agreed. Maybe only 20% of visitors click on Adsense, that’s $0.10 cost for $0.05 earning. I have been thinking to join Adsense, but have no guts because my daily clicks are far less than 1000. I always avoid nickels just to prize my visitors (now $0.20 earning per click, 99% from CJ).
    IRS
    Don't ask why the ball doesn't come.

  13. #13
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    Well, the getting 5 cents for 2 cents is what the deal is with Adsense...when you plug in the sales from SAS and the Indy's, the actual EPC is much higher than that.

    You buy 1,000 for $20 - Adsense brings in $20 to $50, the SAS and Indy sales bring in 10 to 30 sales and at least $100 in commissions.

    Adsense pays the freight and SAS and company bring in the profit.

    I seriously doubt people make more than 5 cents in total clicks when they add up ALL the expenses, including time, taxes, advertising and other overhead.

    If that was the case, Amazon would have been profitable from day one.

  14. #14
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    ?? You make a page it gets crawled and indexed for free. If done right, get free traffic. Put adsense on it, make money. So you can makes lots more than 5 cents a click. Only expense i can think of is bandwidth which is minimal.
    I have a forum that doesn't cost much per month, grows slowly on its own and the Adsense money is great. A lot more than 5 cents a click, lot more.

  15. #15
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    I averaged 22 cents per click on Adsense yesterday, with no advertising fees

    Over $100 in one day. Paying for none of the traffic

  16. #16
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    quote:
    This is really not a hard concept. Find merchants that convert for you.


    and

    quote:
    I could care less what network they're with, they all have their + and - in the end, if they convert for me and pay i'm


    Trusty, as usual, is right on target.

    As far as networks go, the lack of consolidated payments with Linksnare and BF makes experimenting with their merchants more of a risk.

    But Trust is right - you have to do some real analysis to see who's working for you.

    BEGIN MINOR RANT -

    I see a lot of posts with people saying they sent 100 (or 200 or 300) "super-targeted" clicks without a conversion.

    First, I think it's a nice general standard to say you should convert at least 1 out of every 100 clicks, but personally believe that should be calculated over a larger total. Second, "super-targeted" is awfully subjective and, well, let's leave it at that.

    END MINOR RANT

  17. #17
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    "First, I think it's a nice general standard to say you should convert at least 1 out of every 100 clicks, but personally believe that should be calculated over a larger total. Second, "super-targeted" is awfully subjective and, well, let's leave it at that"

    Exactly!

    A lot of the time, a visitor may not even know what they are looking for. Even if they searched for 'blue widget with pink stripes on' it doesn't necessarily mean that that is what they will end up buying, or even if that is what they are even looking for. People are weird, and they search for weird things

  18. #18
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    I am all for the FREE traffic from the Googler and Yahooer...IF you can get indexed it's pretty much FREE money...however, what happens when you get un-indexed...then what do you do?

    You ***** and complain and try to get
    re-indexed but in the meantime you suffer the big drop in income. This little disaster happens all the time to those who rely only on SE traffic.

    BTW...a big problem is people keep comparing Apples with Oranges...what you get per click at Adsense is irrelevant...if you are trying to figure out the revenue from ALL your traffic.

    For example: If your site gets 1,000 visitors in one day from ALL sources and you get 100 Adsense clickthrus and make $20 from Adsense, you are earning 2 CENTS PER Click Thru for ALL the traffic to your site from the Adsense part. If you earn $100 in sales commissions on top of that, you are earning 12 CENTS per click thru for ALL the traffic to your site.

    As for Leaders complaint of 3 cents per visitor profit sucks...if you get 30,000 visitors per month for one webpage, that's $900 per site or webpage - $10,800 for the year.

    Make 10 of them like that and you are in hog heaven. And even more so if the traffic is close to FREE.

    Now the problem is NOT that you can make more from CPA than CPC, the problem is that to do CPA, the networks and merchants need to honest and they are for the most part NOT HONEST.

    Trying to find the honest one's takes time and effort and money.

    I'd rather have the $65,000 NET I got from doing CPC, than the $100,000 I earned but didn't get from the CPA crowd.

    So far, I have been paid on time, everytime by Adsense and by SAS merchants...I can't say that about LS, Performics or CJ ones.

  19. #19
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    quote:
    Originally posted by phillyBurbs.com:
    First, I think it's a nice general standard to say you should convert at least 1 out of every 100 clicks, but personally believe that should be calculated over a larger total. Second, "super-targeted" is awfully subjective and, well, let's leave it at that.

    END MINOR RANT

    If I converted at only 1% for most of my merchants, I would either throw in the towel because I suck at this, or seriously re-evaluate what I'm doing.

    If a merchant converts at or around 1%, I get agitated and start changing my pages, I check the links and experiment with new ones, I change my advertising, I try to target my pages more. I look at my stats to see what most people are looking for. I try to give them exactly that on the landing page without forcing them to click several times to get where they need to go to find what they want. Most of the time this will do the trick and I see the conversion rate increase.

    Those that still don't convert at all or convert well below 1% will eventually get replaced. I have no time to waste with those. Unless it's a merchant that I really like for some reason, or is the only one to offer the products or has a better selection at better prices than most. I lose nothing by keeping them, but I will add more choices for visitors. Replacing merchants is not always easy and can be very time consuming. If other merchants are converting well and making me money, then I may take longer to act on those that don't.

    If after 200 clicks I don't have a sale, something is not right somewhere. And I don't mean the network or tracking or parasites. The merchant simply doesn't convert to my audience, period. I don't blame everyone else for it, I just change my material. I don't need to wait until I have 10,000 clicks to realize that they're not a good fit for my website. Regardless of the real reason that they don't convert. That's really irrelevant, bottom line is that they don't, period.

    As for targeted traffic, anyone who does a search on any search engine is considered targeted in my book. I do a lot of searching online, I am a targeted visitor for many sites, but I rarely buy anything. Sometimes I'm just looking at my competition. Most people are probably just window shopping or looking for info, just like I do.

    Considering the conversion rate in this industry, obviously it doesn't matter how targeted your visitors are if they're not in the mood to buy. Anyone could make a sale with the most untargeted visitor to their site if you catch them at the right time in the right frame of mind.

    When I posted my above post and said "Coincidence?" it could have meant anything and it left people to interpret it the way they wanted. Some people just took the ball and ran with it.

    Catwoman

  20. #20
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    Catwoman you're missing something very important: EPC. Example the 1% you would drop. What if:
    Average sale for that 1% merchant was $1000 and they had 10% commission = $100 for every 100 clicks or $1 a click

    Let's say you have another merchant that had 10% commission too and converted at 5%, the merchant you would keep but the average sale was $100.
    So 100 clicks would give would give you 5 sales of $100, $500 in sales with 10% commission, $50 for every 100 clicks.

    In the end the 1% merchant is doing better for you than the 5% merchant. There are other factors to consider then mere conversion % EPC the most important IMO.

  21. #21
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    Indeed, EPC being the most important *together* with the hard to measure,
    'easiness'/effort to produce the traffic to make the clicks. Which includes clickthru rate,
    but there is also the 'demand' part. Overture 'keyword suggestion' tool can provide insight
    in the number of people looking for something although interpretation can be tricky.

    (added) Then there is the factor of how much of this potential traffic you are able to get.

    Leaving PPC and other costs for getting the traffic out of scope, the *money* you make
    with a merchant/site/prod.cat./item, can be expresssed as:

    $$ = S * P * CTR * EPC

    with S being the number of searchers per time-unit
    P being the portion you are able to acquire
    CTR the clickthru ratio of the ads you present to those visitors
    and EPC being earnings per single click,
    which can be refined into
    EPC = conversion ratio * commission % * average sales price.

    If this has not been written down before (hard to believe), I'd like to coin it as:
    Shmoogle's equation (for directed traffic. banners on general content pages are
    simply #visitors*CTR*EPC)

    Massive traffic that is easy to get with low EPC, can be better than hard to get traffic with high EPC.

  22. #22
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    "Massive traffic that is easy to get with low EPC, can be better than hard to get traffic with high EPC."

    I agree, i have a page then gets lots of traffic but the EPC is horrible, but it brings money in every month and requires no updating on my part. The merchants with the better EPC and the ones that produce month in month out, i try to send them as much traffic as possible and might even make an extra page or 2 for them

    Overture is a decent free tool, but if you want accurate go with the Wordtracker.

  23. #23
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    Trust,

    I have two merchants with very high commissions (several hundred dollars per sale) if I were to ever make a sale. I don't expect them to convert well, but I have no intention of getting rid of them, even if it takes two years to make a sale. They don't cost me any money. I have other merchants that make up for these two while they sit there collecting clicks waiting for a taker.

    The merchants I'm talking about above are average to slightly better than average commissions. Some that have already been replaced were at the low end and a replacement was easy to find. Most products are about the same price, not varying by much, and commissions are almost the same for each one. So this was a no brainer.

    I may be fairly new on this board, I may not be the most knowledgeable person when it comes to every aspect of affiliate marketing, but marketing as an offline industry has been my life for the last 20+ years. I know how to analyze my stats and react accordingly or even be proactive in many cases, I know where and when to make changes, etc. I love to experiment because now I'm the only one involved, I'm not costing a company money if I make a mistake, and I don't have to worry about getting fired for making a wrong turn. Many of the same principles apply online the same way they do offline. I thank my background offline for my conversion rate online. I love what I do even though it frustrates me to no end at times.

    It's difficult to communicate on a discussion board where people don't know who they're talking to. If you don't specify every last little detail, comments can be taken way off track and totally distort the meaning. Since I can't read minds, I don't expect others to read mine.

    Catwoman

  24. #24
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    The key to success in any business is income needs to exceed outgo.

    I have a single page site for a specific niche market. It gets about 30 to 40 visitors per day - 1,000 per month. It has 3 links to click on, Adsense, the Merchant and a Search Box that pays for any search. It brings in about $60 per month and costs $10 per month in PPC.

    It's indexed low on the SE so it gets some FREE traffic. All I do is once a month, transfer $10 from my PayPal account to the PPCSE - takes all of 5 minutes max.

    It gets 10% to 15% Adsense CTR that averages more than $.20 per click, makes 4 to 6 sales per month and $1 to $2 from the search box.

    If you figure $5 for costs plus $10 for PPC, that's a profit margin of 75%.

    Now $40 to $50 per month is not much, but it adds up when you have 10, 20 or 30 of these one page wonders.

    And you really clean up if you can get a high index on Google and get some serious FREE traffic.

    The SO has one that makes $1,000 plus every month for $60 in PPC cost, but it gets lots of bookmark traffic and has a good spot on Yahoo for the main keyword.

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