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  1. #1
    ABW Ambassador
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    Has anyone else recieved the dreaded
    "We regret to inform you that the Commission Junction advertiser ... has chosen to expire its affiliation with you effective "

    Within the last couple of days I got one from New Line Cinema and eHobbies. Of course the affiliate managers never write back when you ask them WHY. I have actually made a good amount of money with NewLine. eHobby never converts so no big deal but the New Line termination sucks.

    In case your wondering, I don't force clicks and I dont bid on PPC terms with the stores names or other TMs.

  2. #2
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    Happens all the time, sometimes for reasons that border on imbecilic.

    "Better now than later" is my take on the matter. F#ck them.

  3. #3
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
    Rhea's Avatar
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    New Line dumped me too. It didn't break my heart because I think it's a very poorly run program and conversions weren't fabulous.

    When a merchant starts dropping affiliates that make sales for them I get concerned they're about to do something radical. Like leave the network or get out of AM altogether.

  4. #4
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    chrisk,

    Why don't you PM me with your CID and I will be happy to take a look.

    We took a number of things into account, but we do make mistakes sometimes.
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  5. #5
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    I wasnt clear enough. Sorry.

    Has anyone else recieved them from these merchants in the last couple days. I was just wondering if i was being singled out by them or if there was some big house cleaning...

    I figured out why ehobbies terminated me. I have a coupon site that comes up first page for their name on one of the search engines. That probably did it.

  6. #6
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    Rhea,

    Same thing, I am happy to personally review your past performance in relation to New Line.

    I was recently hired at New Line Cinema to oversee both our NewLineShop.com & WBShop.com programs. Over the last five weeks we have been working diligently to clean up our programs by removing parasitic accounts. We also determined there were an extraordinary number of publishers driving clicks, but no sales (some were "pops" - some more devious). Those with low or no epc were removed. We did send out several advance notices, but sounds like maybe you didn't receive it.

    So, if you think we made a mistake, PM me and I will look into the details.
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  7. #7
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    Thanks David - NLC !

  8. #8
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    chrisk,

    I think what you are seeing is the increasing pressure on affiliate program managers to raise their program's EPC - we discuss this amongst ourselves quite often. The first thing one does then is remove so-called "EPC Killers."
    Overall, this is a very delicate balancing act because you have partners you like working with, yet the EPC rating system actually provides something of a disincentive for attracting new performing publishers to ones program - I think it actually cuts both ways.

    I can tell you since I now oversee 2 programs that if you think you can send us customers we should be talking. You'll find that I am willing to do most of the listening.
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  9. #9
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    I found out what is going on. 'Network Quality' wrote.

    Aparently i 'might' have a trademark problem because my site uses "lord-rings" as part of the domain name.

    I sell $800-$2000 per month with you but i guess that is your call.

  10. #10
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    quote:
    pressure on affiliate program managers to raise their program's EPC

    quote:
    Those with low or no epc were removed


    As I said, reasons that border on imbecilic.

    The goal should be to increase SALES, not a conceptual, subjective and worthless figure like the vapor that "EPC" is.

    The most productive affiliates you could ever hope to have will have your program on their "to-do" list for the better part of a year in many cases, until they have time to do their thing for you.

    Those same affiliates do not have time to chase you for re-instatement; they'll just move along to the next thing. "No Movie memoribilia to build a site for today? Well howsabout some underwear or gardening supplies." ~ it's all the same to us

  11. #11
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    The biggest EPC killers are the forced click BHO's and the blind cookie stuffers.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

    "What have you done today to put real value into a referral click...from a shoppers viewpoint!"

  12. #12
    I like traffic lights
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    > figured out why ehobbies terminated me. I
    >have a coupon site that comes up first page
    >for their name on one of the search engines.
    >That probably did it.

    Well, what I would do in this situation is redesign the pages to sell their competitors products. Until the SE respiders your page, you will still beat them in the SE's and you can have the pleasure of selling their competitors products from those SE related visits.

    >Aparently i 'might' have a trademark problem
    >because my site uses "lord-rings" as part of
    >the domain name.


    >I sell $800-$2000 per month with you but i
    >guess that is your call.

    Time to sell relevant merchandise from eBay auctions on that page and go tell NLC to stick their trademark where the sun don't shine.

  13. #13
    ABW Ambassador Andy's Avatar
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    A reminder to Merchants who terminate Affiliates in an attempt to raise their EPCs: If there are click throughs from the Affiliate site, the problem of non-conversion is most likely on the MERCHANT'S SITE. An Affiliate can only pre-sell enough to entice the end user to click through, that's it.

    Once they get to the Merchant's site, it's up to the Merchant to convert them. And some Affiliates may be showing clicks and no sales due to parasites intercepting and nabbing the sale. Another thing to consider before you start terminating relationships...you might be terminating the wrong Affiliates!

    Andy

  14. #14
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    well maybe its a good thing, i used to make a few quid with newline and warner bros, but sales went down when parasites moved in, hopefully now, i shall start making the money i should!!!

  15. #15
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    Andy,

    I hear what you are saying. If you are at CJU, I would like to hear more of your thoughts.

    You have to keep in mind that CJ's system "prevents" us from really "seeing" much about a publisher - so we have precious little to evaluate outside the data we are presented. So, yes, the picture is a little one-dimensional.

    As for the job of the merchant to convert traffic, I would disagree and state that it is a shared responsibility. If someone runs a coupon site and claims they have coupon codes for say Brooks Brothers and people click through - is it then Brooks Brothers job to convert people who came in "the door" expecting discounts? (Brooks Brothers is not a discounter). This then is worthless and misdirected traffic. I could go on forever about the forced-click folks & BHO's as well - but then Mike has covered that topic better than I ever could! Bottom line Andy is that we often don't know and so err on the side of caution. We are not infallible, but most of us are certainly approachable.

    And while I am being open, I have publicly stated recently that our network is parasite and BHO-free. But these guys are extremely devious and the only way we can adequately police this is with honest affiliates help.
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  16. #16
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
    Rhea's Avatar
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    Sometimes being dumped by a merchant could be a good thing for the affiliate. I had one merchant that I promoted heavily. When sales declined I took a long, hard look at their redesigned site and found they'd incorporated a variety of methods to circumvent the affiliate cookie. Bummer. All those links to change. My best merchant suddenly not converting so well.

    It was a lot of work but as a result of changing those links to different merchants I'm making more money with CJ than ever before.

    NLC and WBShop have a couple of flaws. One of them is that products are switched out on a regular basis with no notification to the affiliates. At one time affiliates received an internal CJ notification of new products and discontinued products. It would be nice <ahem> if that practice could be reinstated.

  17. #17
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    We've had a handful of sales with NLC. The conversion rate has been adequate, if unspectacular. We didn't receive a termination notice (Note to Dave - please don't send one!), but the program has some nice stuff. The WBShop has generated 0 on a relatively small number of clicks, but we don't play it up as much as NLC.

    Dave: Thanks for the insight into the information available to you for decision making. Perspective is an important thing!

  18. #18
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    Rhea,

    PM me so I can resolve this as best as possible.

    Retailers do constantly move products around based on consumer demand and inventory levels. We do have some cool new Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings items coming into the store over the next few weeks. Much of this information. along with our top selling products is now communicated through our update sent out each month. If you have a specific audience you want to merchandise, I am sure I can volunteer one of my cheerful coworkers to assist.

    If there is a better way, then we want to know about it.

    Nudge, nudge: I have tried calling Haiko repeatedly over the last several weeks to set up a board at ABW and I guess he is just too busy to call back...maybe you can give him a nudge?
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  19. #19
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    phillyBurbs.com,

    I saw your account in there! I recognize the hard work you have put in - we spoke or traded email when I was at Brooks Brothers I believe. The fact that I am originally from Radnor in no way influenced my decision.

    We are ready to work with you and you can email me or PM me and we will give you the lowdown on cool WBShop stuff coming up.

    We have started to see a big pick-up in Halloween related items and between WBShop & NewLineShop we have all the heroes and villains...from Frodo to Freddy Krueger. We even have these really cool party lights that are heads from The Texas Chainsaw Massacre! Not like my days at 1-800-flowers.com, let me tell you...
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  20. #20
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    David:

    I have a new editor taking over our entertainment channels. I'm anxious to see what he can do in terms of affiliate marketing and both NLC and WBShop would be nice components. We should definitely touch base in the next few weeks because I think there's some real potential!

  21. #21
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    David,

    I wrote back concerning the termination (WBShop.com) and received no response only a Bad Link posting within the CJ account. Finally sent you a visitor and your links no longer work!

    I am very disappointed and pulled all links to include the feed.

    Terminating any affiliate during the Xmas season is not always a good move. Even if you do say OOPS we messed up ---- your mess up could take up to 3 months to get our pages back in the engines. If your going to clean house at least do it after the holidays so your sales and our sites are not affected in any manner.

  22. #22
    Full Member David_NLC's Avatar
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    SandraR,

    I am concerned as I sent you a note last night and copied two of the folks who work with me on our programs here since I wanted everyone to be in the loop. It sounds like you did not get it - I'll check into that.

    Your note made a lot of sense.

    I won't copy the whole email, but the relevant part here:

    quote:
    Yet, we share some responsibility as we have not provided you with any information in some time to be successful.

    So, let's cut to it. What would you need from us to be successful? Do NewLineShop & WBShop have items in demand by your visitors? We are willing to take a chance and make a go of it, as long as you share our concern for driving customers versus traffic...neither of us makes a cent off of traffic.


    I am willing to take a chance, are you?
    Best,

    David Rogers
    Sr. Manager, E-Commerce
    New Line Cinema
    212 649-4900
    NewLineShop.com
    WBShop.com
    TheOCInsiderShop.com

  23. #23
    Devil's Reject Electropulse's Avatar
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    I was about to put up more links and content for new line on a horror site I made. thanks for giving me the boot. F'ers

  24. #24
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    quote:
    Originally posted by David - NLC:
    I am willing to take a chance, are you?


    David,

    I do not have the choice, when an affiliate is terminated we cannot re-initiate a partnership.

  25. #25
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
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    Hey David,

    Thanks for listening. I will PM you later this evening.

    I have content sites and primarily promote products and product lines that tie in with my content. I never did much with NLC (pretty much just the animated dolls) but quite a bit with WB. I am a HUGE Looney Tunes fan (the old stuff).

    "Chuck, Chuck, wherefore art thou, Chuck?"

    You gotta imagine that being said in Daffy Duck's lisp.

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