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  1. #1
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    Murder Now Legal In Florida
    Well, Terri Schiavo died in Florida today from court and judge assisted murder through the means of starvation.

    An Expert on the TV said it was a very peaceful death to die from starvation.

    So, what do you think?

    Do you think that if you died from startvation that you would consider you death a very peaceful death?

  2. #2
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    It's a shame it even went public, it should have been kept a private family matter..

    from Shakespeare:

    A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
    The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head.
    Go hence to have no more talk of these sad things.

    All are punished.
    Ebudae


  3. #3
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    On the radio a few minutes ago, I heard a law firm advertisement say, "Don't let what happened to Terri Schiavo happen to you. See the law firm of your choice. Brought to you by such-and-such-amublance-chasing law firm ..... "

    Made me ill.

  4. #4
    The Eternal Optimist zimmy's Avatar
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    It will be interesting to see what the autopsy reveals. I can't imagine starving to death would be very peaceful. I also can't imagine that the neurologists could know for certain that she is not suffering when she has responded to family members. Those two things just don't seem to go together.

    A court-appointed physician testified her brain damage was so severe that there was no hope she would ever have any cognitive abilities.

    Still, her parents, who visited her nearly every day, reported their daughter responded to their voices. Video showing the dark-haired woman appearing to interact with her family was televised nationally. But the court-appointed doctor said the noises and facial expressions were reflexes.



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  5. #5
    ABW Veteran Mr. Sal's Avatar
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    And the other sad thing, is that there will still be a fight now for her body.
    The family wants a Christian burial and the husband want the body cremated.

    Some laws make no sense.

  6. #6
    Affiliate/AM Moonlighter dflsports's Avatar
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    It is an unfortunate event. How does anyone, including the doctors really know what the heck is going on. They always preach about the brain acting in miraculous ways.

    Not that TV is anything like "real" life, but ER had a interesting episode this year that had one of the stars from Sex and the City and she was playing a woman who had a stroke and could hear everything but not communicate. I could not help but think that maybe poor Mrs. Schiavo was in a similar circumstance

  7. #7
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    Reflexes?

    Yea - Right.

    Doesn't it seem strange that these reflexes just happened to happen when her family or the doctors and the nurses that were taking care of her were working with her and around her. I feel that she was responding to them and did know what was going on.

    I wonder if her husband who says that he loves her so much took his girl friend and their baby to see her?

    Sure sounds to me like he really cared about her.

    Maybe her husband wanted to get rid of her to cover up what he did to her to put her in the state she was in to start with.

  8. #8
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    Good op ed piece on this
    http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/3/23/204359/812

    Elbow, i can see it both ways. A living will is something good to have so these situations don't happen.

    No, i don't think it's murder, she's been in a PVS for 15 years. She had no chance of recovery. Families have to make this decicision all the time and they're not murdering their loved ones. It is a family matter and should have been kept that way but certain members solicited outside help.

    "I also can't imagine that the neurologists could know for certain that she is not suffering when she has responded to family members."

    They know a lot, takes a lot of school to become a doctor. That video was just a few seconds out of 15 years, some links you can read in the op-ed link i posted.

    "she was playing a woman who had a stroke and could hear everything but not communicate. I could not help but think that maybe poor Mrs. Schiavo was in a similar circumstance"

    Saw the same episode, not even the same thing.

  9. #9
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    "Maybe her husband wanted to get rid of her to cover up what he did to her to put her in the state she was in to start with."

    Why do you post such ingorant stuff?

  10. #10
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    How do you now it's not true.

  11. #11
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    Because i know how to read.

  12. #12
    ABW Ambassador phillyburbs's Avatar
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    All I can say is, there are no winners in this episode.

  13. #13
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    Well - I only know what I see on the news and the following is what I've seen on the news on CNN and Fox.

    The news said that her husband said that he went home one day and found her on the floor. He said that she had been drinking and then did some drugs and the two didn't mix and that is what happened to her.

    The news also said that the police didn't believe him and tried to charge him with doing something to her. It also said that he managed to get out of the charge.

    The news also said that seven years later she was awarded one million dollars and that 300,000 of it went to him and the other 700,000 went into a trust for her and he could not get it until she died.

    The news also said that right after the one million dollar award that he suddenly remembered that she wanted to die. The news also said that up until the time of the award he had never mentioned that she wanted to die - he only remember it after she got 700,000 dollars that he couldn't get his hands on until she died.

    I don't know what happened and neither do you. We were not there when it happened.

    But, if what the news says is true - something really smells fishy here to me.

    Hope you have a nice day.

  14. #14
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    "The news also said that up until the time of the award he had never mentioned that she wanted to die - he only remember it after she got 700,000 dollars that he couldn't get his hands on until she died."


    "The $700,000 is mostly gone thanks to over a decade of legal challenges brought by her parents and 15 years of medical care; in 2003 Michael's attorneys said there was about $50,000 left."

  15. #15
    MasterMike HardwareGeek's Avatar
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    Let the lady rest in peace.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyburbs
    All I can say is, there are no winners in this episode.
    Too true...

    This hits too close to home.... My wife works in a retirement home as a CNA in the Alzheimer/Dementia unit. She tell's me stories about people on Hospise per the family's request, sometimes they dont get water or food.. just morphine.

  17. #17
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    It is over
    >Let the lady rest in peace.
    Well said.

  18. #18
    Affiliate Marketing Consultant Andy Rodriguez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HardwareGeek
    Let the lady rest in peace.
    Ditto...
    Andy Rodriguez Consulting, Affiliate Program Management and Consulting Services, Since 2001
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  19. #19
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    Well - Maybe he wants the 50,000 - maybe he thinks that 50,000 is better then nothing.

    He says that he loves Terri so much but I still wonder if he took his girl friend and their baby to see her when she was alive. Having a girl friend and having a child with your girl friend when you are married to another woman does not sound like he loved Terri so much to me.

    I'm not fighting with you about it TrustNo1. We are just having a debate about it.

    Debates are good sometimes when people have different opinions.



  20. #20
    Chick with Brains Tracy's Avatar
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    What news are you watching? You've bungled so many facts it's hard to know where to begin.

    "The news said that her husband said that he went home one day and found her on the floor. He said that she had been drinking and then did some drugs and the two didn't mix and that is what happened to her."
    Terri collapsed in her house one morning in 1990, shortly after a fertility-related medical procedure. ... Her collapse woke her husband Michael, and she was rushed to the hospital with multiple resuscitations en-route.
    "The news also said that the police didn't believe him and tried to charge him with doing something to her. It also said that he managed to get out of the charge."
    ...a USA TODAY review of voluminous records in the Probate Division of Pinellas County Circuit Court in nearby Clearwater.

    Those records show that Michael Schiavo and the Schindlers jointly supervised care for Terri after she collapsed. For the first 16 days and nights that she was hospitalized, Schiavo never left the hospital. Over the next few years, as she was moved from the hospital to a skilled nursing facility, to a nursing home, to Schiavo's home and finally back to a nursing home, Schiavo visited Terri daily.
    "The news also said that right after the one million dollar award that he suddenly remembered that she wanted to die. The news also said that up until the time of the award he had never mentioned that she wanted to die - he only remember it after she got 700,000 dollars that he couldn't get his hands on until she died."
    It is a feud, to some degree, over principle. Michael Schiavo says Terri should be allowed to die because she told him long before she was stricken that she would never want to be kept alive by a feeding tube or other such measures. The Schindlers say their son-in-law is starving Terri to death. They want to keep her alive and try to rehabiliate her.

    But it also appears to be a fight over money - how a $1 million malpractice settlement Schiavo won 13 years ago over Terri's care should be spent.

    Without that emotional public schism, the Schiavo case might simply have been one of thousands of wrenching family decisions about life and death that unfold quietly every year.
    ---

    "On Feb. 14, 1993, this amicable relationship between the parties was severed," Greer wrote. "While the testimony differs on what may or may not have been promised to whom and by whom, it is clear to this court that such severance was predicated upon money and the fact that Mr. Schiavo was unwilling to equally divide his loss of consortium award with Mr. and Mrs. Schindler."

  21. #21
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    I have seen what I stated on CNN and Fox both in the last month.

    However, as you and I both know you can hear something different on the news every day about the same topic and it will be different every day.

    Although I did hear it on the news - whose to say if it was correct or not.

    I was stating that if it was correct - his motives sure seemed questionable to me.

  22. #22
    Moderator BurgerBoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Sal
    And the other sad thing, is that there will still be a fight now for her body.
    The family wants a Christian burial and the husband want the body cremated.

    Some laws make no sense.

    None of them seem to be able to agree on anything that they do.

    He got his wish - Terri is dead now. It looks like he could at least let her parents have her body.

    After all - they are the ones who gave birth to her - not him.

  23. #23
    Full Member Verbalkent's Avatar
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    I really disagree with the politics behind this event. The husband (that damn bastid) should have givin the ultimate choice to the blood relatives. I feel bush (cough** satan) and the rest of the government SHOULD NOT have intervined. To die of starvation is not humane at all, death row inmates get more mercy than that. Makes me furious.

  24. #24
    Affiliate Miester my2cents's Avatar
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    all I can say is I'm glad she finally died... maybe now the family can have some time to morn their loss...

    what really steamed me was all the opertunists who latched on to this families tragety..

    for their own gain...

    I just hope that if this ever happens to me... that my wife will have the courage to do the same for me...

    Joe
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    that's my2cents, 'cuz I'm a legend in my own mind....

  25. #25
    Chick with Brains Tracy's Avatar
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    I live in Florida, and my first gut reaction was on the side of the Schindlers. But, the other night I spent literally hours reading all accounts of this story, and now I think that it is a private family matter that should have been kept that way. Every year families are faced with this sort of decision, and disagree on what should be done.

    But, if you think that Michael Schiavo's motives are questionable, some of the things I learned that make me think otherwise:

    *His demanding concern for Terri's well-being and meticulous care by the nursing home earned him the characterization by the administrator, "As a nursing home administrator's nightmare." Mr. Schiavo demanded and got an extraordinarily high level of care for his wife. Mrs. Schiavo had suffered no decubitus ulcers (aka bed sores), which patients in such a condition typically suffer.

    *Michael Schiavo even trained as a nurse, in order to better assist in her care. (He now works as a nurse at a local prision.)

    *He refused the $1 Million offered to him to transfer guardianship to her parents. If this was about greed, he would have accepted the money. For him it was about doing what his wife would have wanted.

    Lincoln said (parapharising) that most arguments between men are not between right and wrong (good and evil), but between two different views of what is right.

    After everything I have read on this issue, my feeling is that Michael Schiavo truly loves his wife, and that in his heart believes that he is carrying out her wishes, and doing what she would have wanted.

    I believe her parents truly love their daughter, and didn't want to let her go, and fought with every means possible to keep her alive. Unfortunately, this included assaulting their son-in-law with accusations of abuse, neglect, greed, adultry ... and bringing a private, family matter to the attention of the rest of the world.

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