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  1. #1
    Full Member tmd5's Avatar
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    What is happening at ebay.com? Just noticed all their $5 commissions have been extended! I've never seen ebay do anything like that before. Now I know they changed their commission structure but I assumed they wouldn't credit $5 to a publisher's account until the person signing up had bought or sold something at ebay.

    Also are ebay.com planning to move their affiliate account to BeFree I wonder? I notice on the ebay website that they advertise their affiliate setup with Befree and I wonder when that happened. Is it recent?

    Are the days of CJ/ebay.com coming to an end or am I over-reacting?

  2. #2
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    Tmd5, I'd say we have some reason to be alarmed alright.
    All of mine are extended too! When ebay changed their lead definition they said they would pay us an extra dollar but the registrant had to become active within the month following the initial action.

    Now here is the part that irks me. It said if they didn't become active it would be treated as a reversal.

    (I guess this is a MASS PRE REVERSAL?)
    They were not specific at all about what *active* actually means. hmmm...

    I am going to stop promoting them now and wait and see if these extensions convert next month before promoting them again.

  3. #3
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    A move to reporting.net would make good sense for a firm such as ebay, which likes to keep its affiliates in the dark.

    By the way, did they extend any of the 5 cent commissions?

  4. #4
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    nope, not as of yet

  5. #5
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Your sure right on keeping BeFree affiliates in the dark. BeFree has been hinting at a sell out and targets include Yahoo -AOL -eBay. Aol makes the most sense since they already have a cement fortress for merchandising 20 FT high around those 26 million shoppers.

  6. #6
    Full Member tmd5's Avatar
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    The curious thing is none of the 5c have been reversed but all the $5 have. I thought we only got a 5c commission on a buy/sale from a $5 sign up. Shouldn't some of the $5s be accepted in that case? Or I am being particularly thick about this? :confused:

  7. #7
    I like traffic lights
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    Affiliates were pre-warned by eBay about the requirement to extend leads in an email sent via the CJ mail system quite some time ago.

    I was going to pasteit here, but it's disappeared from inside my CJ mailbox :^(

    Because of the extensions eBay is paying us an extra premium this month to make up for it. Can't remember the exact percentage. 30%?

    >I thought we only got a 5c commission on a
    >buy/sale from a $5 sign up.

    No, you get a $5c commission on ANY bid coming from your site, even if the bidder joined eBay before CJ existed.

    That is all.

  8. #8
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    Aah !

    Thank God I left ebay...I learned my lesson at clicktrade(bcentral)

    Regards
    TGO

  9. #9
    Full Member tmd5's Avatar
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    I also deleted the ebay emails detailing the changes. All I can find now on the website and CJ is "You'll receive $5.00 every time someone clicks on your eBay link and becomes an active registered user by placing a bid on eBay. Plus, you will earn $0.05 each time the user comes back and places a bid through an eBay link on your site."

  10. #10
    Ad Network Rep ToddCrawford's Avatar
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    eBay will pay $5 for a new "active" registration. Once someone registers at eBay, they have 30 days to make at least one bid and become "active". If the 30 day period has not expired by the time the CJ system needs to run publisher payroll, eBay must extend the transactions. eBay will either pay the transaction next month (if a bid takes place) or reverse it.

    The $0.05 per bid is paid when a click results in a registered user placing a bid.

    eBay is going to give publishers a bonus in January of 40% for registrations generated in December.

    So, here is how it might look. If you earned $100 in registrations (20 leads)in December, you will get a bonus of $40 in January. Most of those registrations will get extended until eBay can determine whether they became "active". If a registration occured on the 4th of December, the soonest eBay can determine that it became active is January 8 (there's a five day delay in getting the data from eBay's database - so you need to add 5 days to the 30 activation period).

    Theoretically, a publisher could earn $140 in December if all 20 registrations (=$100) became active within 30 days, plus the 40% bonus.

    Does this help clear things up?

    Regards,

  11. #11
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    As someone who has made more than a good amount from eBay over the years, you will
    get paid sometime for the legitimate stuff you sent.

    The problem, however, with this new program is this:

    When someone signs up for eBay they give eBay their name, address, phone, email address and a bunch more data.

    And if they don't become active they don't pay, but eBay still has the demographics and can spam these people, sell their list, do all sorts of stuff with that make them money.

    AND YOU GET ZIP. For example:

    Ebay can sell their NON-active list for $55 to $110/1,000 to hundreds of direct mailer types all day long.

    That's why leads are so valuable if you get the name, address, phone, email, gender, education, residence type and income level.

    But most affiliates do not know this fact.

    A name and email address might be worth a nickel to say $.20 to get but the full demographics is easily worth from $2 to $5.
    $5 with the phone number and ggender, education income data.

    We affiliates get screwed by not getting paid for EVERY lead we send

  12. #12
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    ..yet ebay did increase their cookie duration to 30 days, and I would have to say that, although I do not make a huge amount of money yet, on a hit/sale ratio, I get better sales with them than anyone else, regardless of placement at CJ or linkshare or shareasale or the few other independent programs that I use.

    And yeah, the extra nickels aren't gonna buy me a yacht, but it comes from people who are already registered at ebay, and there are a zillion of 'em.

    -elbowcreek

  13. #13
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    I'm generating less 5 cent commissions than I did $5 commissions before. WTF?

  14. #14
    Full Member tmd5's Avatar
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    Todd - thank you. That's made things much clearer.

    Elbowcreek - ebay reduced their cookie duration from 45 days to 30 last year. That, plus the change in commission structure which makes financial sense from eBay's point of view but means less earnings for affiliates, plus the extended transactions was beginning to ring alarm bells here. However, I'm reasssured about the extended transactions by Todd's response.

  15. #15
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    Anybody get a call from Befree inviting them to join ebay's new reporting.net program?

  16. #16
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    Todd wrote:

    eBay will pay $5 for a new "active" registration. Once someone registers at eBay, they have 30 days to make at least one bid and become "active". If the 30 day period has not expired by the time the CJ system needs to run publisher payroll, eBay must extend the transactions. eBay will either pay the transaction next month (if a bid takes place) or reverse it.

    So are you saying that the $5 leads I'm seeing in December may get reversed if the person does not bid on an item? Or are leads not posted until someone bids on an item?

    I've seen a tremendous drop in the conversion rate from pre-change to post-change. For both Q4 2001 and June-Dec 2001 eBay converted 1 out of every 40 visitors I sent. Since the change, based on January data, eBay has converted 1 out of every 219 visitors I sent.

    I assumed that the drop was due to people not bidding on an item, but if you're saying that the lead gets recorded before the bid is tracked, and then gets reversed when no bid is placed, then that's even worse -- it means that there's a chance my measly 2 leads in January may disappear.

    Can you speak to why I might see such a tremendous dropoff in leads? I haven't changed my code placement, and my site's traffic/demographic hasn't changed either. In other words, I haven't done anything different on my end to warrant such a dropoff.

    Based on my prior months conversion rate, and on the assumption that only qualified leads are posted, I estimate that 9 out of 11 leads are making their way through the signup process but are not bidding. Why would that be so high? Why would someone go through the trouble of registering but not bid on an item? Why register if you don't intend to bid?

    Ralph

  17. #17
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    Ralph,

    Welcome!

    Haiko

  18. #18
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    I finally got a $5 commission from ebay after the few nickles they through my way. I wondering if some of the other auction sites might be better revenue generators.

  19. #19
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    I know my post was long winded, but can anyone answer the three basic questions I raised:

    1) Do the few $5 leads that I'm seeing represent "qualified leads", or will they be pulled back in 30 days if no one bids on an item?

    2) Why would eBay have converted 1 out of every 40 referrals before the change, and 1 out of every 220 referrals after the change?

    3) Based on those proportions, why would an estimated 80% (9/11) people sign up for eBay from my site but not bid on an item? What's the reason to sign up but not bid?

    Ralph

    [ 01-17-2002: Message edited by: Ralph Slate ]

  20. #20
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    eBay is still cartooning ! When whey will start to pay normally? :mad:

    [ 01-20-2002: Message edited by: Lokhankin ]

  21. #21
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    Ralph, since I don't promote eBay I haven't paid enough attention to them to answer the first two.

    But I may be able to shed some light on #3: Why sign up without an intention to bid.

    Way back when, I considered selling some items on eBay. But at the time, there were certain parts of the site I couldn't get to without signing up (I forgot what, and they may have changed it by now). So I signed up. But I remain one of the few who have not done any transactions on eBay to this day!

    In other words, it was CURIOSITY which drove me to sign up. Once that curiosity was satisfied, I went back to doing business the regular way--buying new merchandise from online and offline stores.

  22. #22
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    Todd,

    If it dosen't make economic sense to affiliates, it doesn't matter if it makes economic sense to merchants or not.

    Without affiliates in action being a merchant is a losing proposition.

    Merchants are low man on the totem pole. When you guys ever figure that out, you will
    win the game.

    We don't need your merchants - there are thousands of merchant that have affiliate programs. But merchants need CJ because you have access to 250,000 affiliates.

    Unfortunately for you, affiliates will be dictating the minimum terms for merchants by their choice of who to promote and who to not promote. The more junk merchants you sign up the more $250 you will make and the worse your reputation among merchants will become.

    Pretty soon, you will join the merchant grave yard of Snare & BeScrewed.

    On Clickbank alone there are at least 25 deals where even the most virtually
    ignorant affiliate could average making $5 per day in commission ($150/month) if they could get 150- 200 visitors per day to their site.

    If you guys had a clue, you'd force merchants to pay this fee structure or go somewhere else.

    $250/month and 15% of payout (down from 30%), minimum of 1 cent per click thru tracked as a lead against commission or lead income. (This means if the affiliate sends merchants 2000 visitors he gets a check sales or no sales. if his commissions are greater than $20 he gets that amount.)Minimum lead price is $1.00 for name address, phone and email. Any other demographics requested makes the lead a $3.00. Minimum percentage of sales is 10%.
    Minimum per sale is $5 on sales up to $50. Anything sales greater than $50 must be paid by percentage.

    Would merchants pay this amount? Some will if they want good affiliates. It's like buying an ad in Modern Maturity magazine. A full page costs $100K. If you want to reach 15,000,000 members of AARP who have over $15 billion in disposible income, you buy it.

    If you don't have the $100k, life's a***** and then you die.

    We have 7,000 affiliates on CJ.

    Before you morons ditched the CPC, we were making close to $30,000 every month and we were paying our CJ affiliates around $4,000 per month and CJ around $1,000.

    Since then because we were FORCED to go to a lead deal so we could keep our affiliates, we haven't done zip and traffic dropped 99%,
    and our affiliates have made almost zero. If I wasn't making more than the $250 required per month, I'd have been gone.

    But since we set up a merchant deal at Clixgalore on January 1st, we now get 300,000 banners spun every day and traffic is now over 1,000 and we are making money again, instead of chump change. And our new affiliates there are all making some money.

    In February we are going to change our CJ program to a per sale deal so our affiliates can make money again. We finally found a quality product that we can sell for more than 50% off retail, pay affiliates a good amount to go along with your extra 30% gouge and make a profit. But, it took 6 months to find it.

    I have no real problems with CJ, except your incredible stupidity in listening idiots like Bill Gross instead of your affiliates who are on the front line where the action is and doing it.

    And I know you are going to say Bill made billions of $. And it's true. But he lost over 90% of it too. And from my way of thinking, you have to be the world's biggest idiot to lose $7 Billion.

  23. #23
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    Freddie, are you in fact up to date in ALL payments to your own affiliates? With numbers like this it would seem like you'd have little trouble. I hear mixed stories. What's the truth here?
    quote:
    we were making close to $30,000 every month and we were paying our CJ affiliates around $4,000 per month and CJ around $1,000.

  24. #24
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    For new merchants and even the older ones their main problem is getting active affiliates. I'm sure buried amongst the 1500+ merchants are some product selling jewels for my CyberMalls...but newbee merchants have no EPC or $$$$$ signs to give me a hint so I'll start Y2002 off with a hunt for CJ gold. A real house cleaning there is still in order but a wise merchant will troll these boards and pick up some hints as to who is active.

    I'll also clean house on some non-performers and up the exposure/clicks to those merchants/networks that actually paid me in Y2001.

  25. #25
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    I still dont know how the hell the leads are being tracked. I know for sure I got one active signup and its been tracked as a 5 cent sale for the past 2 weeks. I'm hoping eBay just converts sales into leads. My question is how long does it take? I heard possibly 30 to 35 days but not sure.

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