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  1. #1
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    What a Joke Kanoodle Is
    I was thinking of giving Kanoodle a try for some ppc. I had already registered, but when I tried to find out a little VERY BASIC info, like what a min. bid is, etc., it seemed I couldn't do so without first giving them my credit card and $50. I looked and looked but always came up against that same wall whereby I would have to give them $50 before I could find anything out. I thought that couldn't be so, so I wrote them an email. A rep wrote back to say you can register for free, give me a call. What? I thought. I just want some simple info. I'm not interested in talking to some sales rep who just wants a chance to hardsell me. I wrote back to say that. He wrote back, not answering my question, of course, and said, "I'll give you a call."

    Now, why can't I get some basic info like how much a min. bid is without giving them $50? I think I know why. With the likes of Yahoo and MSN getting into the ppc game, if I were a Kanoodler, I'd start looking for another job pretty quick.

  2. #2
    Member daweller2's Avatar
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    Same thing happened to me more or less.
    Kanoodle = might as well burn your money with fire.

  3. #3
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    I tried Kanoodle several times.. my opinion is that the traffic you get is basically worthless and doesn't result in any sales. The same goes for Findwhat, and also Overture (although Overture burns through cash like no tomorrow).

    Google AdWords seem to work best for me.
    Innovative advertising with Slimeware Corporation and Telephore. Mail-order fuel with Petrol Direct.

  4. #4
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    Overture is good. Many people say it converts a little better than AdWords for them. For me, it's just a little less. No other PPCSE that I've tried even comes close to those two, though.
    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com
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    "Education is the most powerful weapon which you can use to change the world." Nelson Mandela

  5. #5
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelColey
    Overture is good. Many people say it converts a little better than AdWords for them. For me, it's just a little less. No other PPCSE that I've tried even comes close to those two, though.
    It was a big cash burner for me, but then that was Overture UK which is much more expensive.
    Innovative advertising with Slimeware Corporation and Telephore. Mail-order fuel with Petrol Direct.

  6. #6
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    the other day I read a disturbing article on Kanoodle. Someone signed up and was amazed at the CTRs they were getting, but when they checked their stats they were shocked to see not one had converted to a sale. The stats also showed the traffic was only staying on the site for 1 second. They concluded this must be computer generated clicks and immediately stopped using them.

    Has anyone had a similar experience?

  7. #7
    Affiliate Manager Sami B - Uncommon Goods's Avatar
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    They seem to have a "click validation" process, which is odd I think. When you click on a PPC ad, they take a page to confirm your intention of clicking that ad by confirming a random code.

  8. #8
    Affiliate Manager PingoPrepaidCallingCards's Avatar
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    Target your market when picking a ppc vendor
    Its interesing to see the debate as to which ppc engines to use. Sometimes it comes down too what audience is shopping on that engine. Yahoo has more of a shopping customer and Google has a strong researching tech customer.

    With the smaller ppc engines. I've heard that its not so much there traffic thats the issues. but its partners traffic and the quility that its sending.

    keep on testing conversion. good luck

    Brian
    Last edited by MichaelColey; February 22nd, 2006 at 02:00 PM. Reason: Removed Manual Signature

  9. #9
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    Kanoodle is

    And here is why:

    I've noticed that they generate clicks like crazy especially all your daily budget is depleted almost immediately after the account is active. I've also found something very fishy. One time I had no funds in the account and I added $50 to my Kanoodle account. Now, matter of nano second I had 2 clicks generated from Kanoodle. Now is this possible? They can't activate my account that fast.

    Bottomline, Kanoodle is not worth investing your money.

  10. #10
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    This is my take -

    Keep the 1st tiers and get rid of all the 2nd tiers. Or if you guys still insist in investing in 2nd tier, just give me the money.

    Mike

  11. #11
    Affiliate Manager PingoPrepaidCallingCards's Avatar
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    I used to sell click fraud analysis. Its not the 2nd teir search engine but its partners. However the concern with click fraud is that if the search engine were to really track fraud. they would lose a tone of business from really turning on these tools.

    such a touchy subject. How do you define click Fraud? it used to be is it all hype untill google had that 90 million dollar settlement....... i think that makes it legally real.

    I still think that there is room for affilaite success with small min bids on smaller engines which we allow in pingo's affilaite program. Since the raise of click fraud potential happens the higher the bids. etc. I've heard 5 to 20% potential click fraud the closer you get to $5 plus cpc.

    thats my two cents. whats yours?

    Brian
    Brian Hawkins AM @ [URL=http://www.pingo.com/affiliate.do]Pingo[/URL] Earn up to $35 CPA for a [URL=http://www.pingo.com/p/onedollar/onedollar.html]$1 trial offer[/URL]!
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  12. #12
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    I used kanoodle 1 time, 2 years ago (so this info is dated, and may not be still accurate.) I gave them $50.00, set up 1 VERY NICHE campaign, and watched my $50.00 disappear in under 24 hours.

    Not that many people search on that term in a MONTH, much less 24 hours.

    You do the math.

    It pains me to say, because their office is right down the highway from me in Buffalo.
    Kevin Webster
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  13. #13
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    Well Brian,

    I have to say that I haven't used all the 2nd tiers out there, however; I did use quite alot of them and I'm speaking from my own experience. I mean at least with the 1st tiers you have conversions. For all the 2nd tiers that I've used, the bounce rate is $95 or higher with couple or no conversion. After a while, you lose faith in the 2nd tiers and you almost feel that it is completely pointless to try them out. This is my opinion.

    Mike

  14. #14
    Lite On The Do, Heavy On The Nuts Donuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PingoPrepaidCallingCards
    Its not the 2nd teir search engine but its partners.
    They CHOOSE their partners and should have practices, policies and enforcement to ensure quality - it's in their vested interest.

    Sadly, they sing the blame game as the cash suckers checks.

  15. #15
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    I just cancelled my very brief Kanoodle campaign a couple of days ago. Over 1000 visitors, no conversions, none of them stayed for more than 5 seconds or generated more than 1 pageview.

    Niche keywords on Google that go for $2.50 or better can be had on Kanoodle for 5 cents, which says a lot right there.

    I found Kanoodle to be 95%+ junk traffic.

  16. #16
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
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    With most "second tier" PPC search engines, you'll find one of two things:

    1) They deliver valid traffic, but it's so limited that it's seldom worth your time.

    2) They delivery the same amount of valid traffic as the first group, but they also deliver dozens (or hundreds) of worthless or fraudulent clicks for every valid click.

    The first group is rare.
    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com
     Affiliate Tips | Merchant Best Practices | Affiliate Friendly? | Couponing | CPA Networks? | ABW Tips | Activating Affiliates
    "Education is the most powerful weapon which you can use to change the world." Nelson Mandela

  17. #17
    Lite On The Do, Heavy On The Nuts Donuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tjensen
    none of them stayed for more than 5 seconds
    Maybe their visitors read really fast?

    Kidding, it's garbage traffic. And you'd be surprised at some of the places and methods you can uncover concerning where / how your ad "shows" (I use the term loosely).

    Now, I will say something nice about Kanoodle. Although it's chock full of nutty and wacky distribution methods, if you catch a cheater, document it and report it to Kanoodle, they actually do something about it. So if you've got a spare 3,000 hours per year to montior your ads throughout their extensive distribution network (again, I use the term loosely), perhaps you can whittle away all of the bad players for your keywords.

    Question then will be, is there any traffic left? Perhaps that the 5% that's left (referring to your 95% junk assertion).

    Some refs:
    http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,119016,00.asp (paragraph 10)
    http://www.intermute.com/spyware/404Search.html (paragraph 1)

    Kanoodle is also doing some things that many others are not:
    http://www.kanoodle.com/about/partner.html
    +RSS ads (who's watching this relatively new ad syndication method for fraud?)
    +BrightAd Cookies (read how it works and you'll understand why I'm not a believer)
    +BrightAd Pops (read the part that says "We'll pay you each time a visitor is shown a BrightAds Pop - your visitors don't even need to make a click" and think it through... there are paying advertisiers on the other end of that transaction...)
    +DomainHop (ah yes, the value of highly targetted parked domain traffic...)

  18. #18
    The "other" left wing davidh's Avatar
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    I'll tell you what.

    A few years back, I made a double typo and misspelled both words of a two-word phrase that I bid on what is either the #1 or #2 "second tier" PPC outfit. It is highly unlikely that there would even be 2 searches per month on this bumbled and contorted phrase across Yahoo, Google, and MSN combined. In fact, even if it was spelled properly, I doubt it would garner more than a couple dozen queries per month across the big three, as it was a fairly obscure term too begin with. But I was getting a hit per second on that term from a page that did not exist when I clicked over to the referring URL. The home page of that domain was the typical domain-park landing page with a pile of links to sleazy lead offers. Sucked my 50 bucks up faster than a Denver lawyer.

    Stick with Google, Yahoo, and MSN. And watch your back with them, too.

  19. #19
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    It's amazing how these companies conduct business in this fashion and live with it. Just so unethical.

  20. #20
    Lite On The Do, Heavy On The Nuts Donuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Onveon Education Search
    It's amazing how these companies conduct business in this fashion and live with it. Just so unethical.
    Indeed.

    http://www.spywareguide.com/spydet_1284_404search.html

    "Official Description: 404Search is adware targeted at 404search.com. It uses sites controlled by the Kanoodle search engine."

  21. #21
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    AdWords and YSM are the only serious PPCs, the other cheap ones are cheap for a reason - the traffic quality is criminally appalling. A lot of the traffic is surfers using pay-to-click programs, they have absolutely no real interest in your product at all. It usually works out that these engines are really far more expensive than AdWords/YSM, because they almost never convert. Don't waste your time or money with these,

    Cheers,
    Jeremy

  22. #22
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    When I used Kanoodle a few years ago, I gave them a list of traffic sources that I would not pay for, and they agreed to run a campaign for me on that basis. They might not do that anymore, but they did try to work with me on that. Still, I wasn't that happy with conversion rates, as I recall.
    Following everyone else is a GREAT way to become average.

  23. #23
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    Kanoodle is weird
    Also, I am a partner that put Kanoodle ads on my site, and the reporting doesn't give you any details besides amount earned, there is no support to contact when having problems, and it is difficult to manage and make the ad types and colors you want. I don't know how these guys stay in business.

  24. #24
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    What I will concentrate on for Xmas advertising will be top tier PPC, and specific web site placement, rather than any 2nd tier sites.
    Following everyone else is a GREAT way to become average.

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