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  1. #1
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    Will Tears Ever Stop?
    I can't help crying. As soon as I see a person on TV
    telling the heart-rendering story of the tragic fate of their
    loved-one in
    the World
    Trade Center disaster, I can't control my tears. But then I
    wonder why
    didn't I cry when our troops wiped out some 5,000 poor people
    El Chorillo neighborhood on the excuse of looking for Noriega.
    Our leaders
    knew he was hiding elsewhere but we destroyed El Chorillo
    the folks
    living there were nationalists who wanted the U.S. out of
    Worse still, why didn't I cry when we killed two million
    mostly innocent peasants, in a war which its main architect,
    Secretary Robert McNamara, knew we could not win? When I went
    give blood
    the other day, I spotted a Cambodian doing the same, three up
    the line,
    and that reminded me: Why didn't I cry when we helped Pol Pot
    another million by giving him arms and money, because he was
    opposed to
    "our enemy" (who eventually stopped the killing fields)?
    To stay up but not cry that evening, I decided to go to a
    movie. I
    chose Lumumba, at the Film Forum, and again I realized that I
    hadn't cried
    when our government arranged for the murder of the Congo's only
    leader, to be replaced by General Mobutu, a greedy, vicious,
    dictator. Nor did I cry when the CIA arranged for the overthrow
    Indonesia's Sukarno, who had fought the Japanese World War II
    invaders and
    established a free independent country, and then replaced him
    General, Suharto, who had collaborated with the Japanese and
    to execute at least half a million "Marxists" (in a country
    where, if folks
    had ever heard of Marx, it was at best Groucho)?
    I watched TV again last night and cried again at the
    picture of that
    wonderful now-missing father playing with his two-month old
    child. Yet when
    I remembered the slaughter of thousands of Salvadorans, so
    described in the Times by Ray Bonner, or the rape and murder of
    American nuns and lay sisters there, all perpetrated by CIA
    trained and
    paid agents, I never shed a tear. I even cried when I heard how
    brave had
    been Barbara Olson, wife of the Solicitor General, whose
    political views I
    detested. But I didn't cry when the US invaded that wonderful
    Caribbean nation of Grenada and killed innocent citizens who
    hoped to get a
    better life by building a tourist airfield, which my government
    proof of a Russian base, but then finished building once the
    island was
    secure in the US camp again.
    Why didn't I cry when Ariel Sharon, today Israel's prime
    planned, then ordered, the massacre of two thousand poor
    Palestinians in
    the refugee camps of Sabra and Shatila, the same Sharon who,
    other Irgun and Stern Gang terrorists become prime ministers as
    Begin and
    Shamir, killed the wives and children of British officers by
    blowing up the
    King David hotel where they were billeted?
    I guess one only cries only for one's own. But is that a
    reason to
    demand vengeance on anyone who might disagree with us? That's
    Americans seem to want. Certainly our government does, and so
    most of
    our media. Do we really believe that we have a right to exploit
    the poor
    folk of the world for our benefit, because we claim we are free
    and they
    are not?
    So now we're going to go to war. We are certainly entitled
    to go
    after those who killed so many of our innocent brothers and
    sisters. And
    we'll win, of course. Against Bin Laden. Against Taliban.
    Against whoever and whatever. In the process we'll kill a few
    children again. Children who have no clothes for the coming
    winter. No
    houses to shelter them. And no schools to learn why they are
    guilty, at two
    or four or six years old. Maybe Evangelists Falwell and
    claim their death is good because they weren't Christians, and
    maybe some
    State Department spokesperson will tell the world that they
    so poor
    that they're now better off.
    And then what? Will we now be able to run the world the way
    we want
    to? With all the new legislation establishing massive
    surveillance of you
    and me, our CEOs will certainly be pleased that the folks
    against globalization will now be cowed for ever. No more riots
    Seattle, Quebec or Genoa. Peace at last.
    Until next time. Who will it be then? A child grown-up who
    our massacre of his innocent parents in El Chorillo? A
    girl who
    learned that her doctor mother and father were murdered by a
    bunch of
    gangsters we called democratic contras who read in the CIA
    handbook that
    the best way to destroy the only government which was trying to
    give the
    country's poor a better lot was to kill its teachers, health
    personnel, and
    government farm workers? Or maybe it will be a bitter Chilean
    convinced that his whole family was wiped out on order of
    of State Henry Kissinger who could never tell the difference
    between a
    communist and a democratic socialist or even a nationalist.
    When will we Americans learn that as long as we keep trying
    to run
    the world for the sake of the bottom line, we will suffer
    revenge? No war will ever stop terrorism as long as we use
    to have
    our way. So I stopped crying because I stopped watching TV. I
    went for a
    walk. Just four houses from mine. There, a crowd had
    to lay
    flowers and lit candles in front of our local firehouse. It was
    closed. It
    had been closed since Tuesday because the firemen, a wonderful
    bunch of
    friendly guys who always greeted neighborhood folks with smiles
    and good
    cheer, had rushed so fast to save the victims of the first
    that they
    perished with them when it collapsed.
    And I cried again.
    So I said to myself when I wrote this, don't send it; some
    of your
    students, colleagues, neighbors will hate you, maybe even harm
    you. But
    then I put on the TV again, and there was Secretary of State
    Powell telling
    me that it will be okay to go to war against these children,
    these poor
    folks, these US-haters, because we are civilized and they are
    not. So I
    decided to risk it.
    Maybe, reading this, one more person will ask: Why are so
    many people
    in the world ready to die to give us a taste of what we give

  2. #2
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    In the old days armies attacked villages and burned them to the ground, raped the women, enslaved the men and children or just killed them. (many of these so called innocent people you speak of still do this)

    I have wrote and rewrote this thread 8 times and can't say anything nice, so I will end with this but I want it to be clear, I do not agree with you at all.

    Oh wait here is something nice. I do cry for those people and I pray daily that the innocent people of Afghanistan are safe.

    PS someone else posted a link to and I found it to be very informative.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    Heyder,you reserve the right to disagree but in this case you disagree absolutely because we american people are ignorant of what our government& CIA do outside of our country.

    And as far as war on terror is concerned our government is just making us fool.This war has to do with tremendous oilfields & resources in central asia than to end terrorism.Because the present oil reserves in gulf will last for 20-25 years.Had Bush been honest in fighting terrorism ,he would have identified the worlds no.1 terrorist organization Israel's Mosad.This is the same mosad which was the plotter of the WTC attack.(We have been continually been fooled by our media that it was Al-Qaeda.This stupid Al-Qaeda is even not capable of doing anything nearer to 1/100th of the attack.The attack of september 11 simply coulnot be successful without the internal support of CIA & people inside our government.)This phenomenon of attacking our own people to get justification for counter-attacking our enemies is not un-common amongst the west.We did the same with pearl harbor,when we trapped Japanese to attack ourselves & then we counter attacked by two atom bombs(biggest violation of humanity in history).

    Why the 27 organizations & persons on
    the list are all muslims.There are atleast 40 other terrorist organizations that are non-muslims but were not identified in the list.What is this bullshit.Our government thinks it can fool us into thinking that it is war on terror..

    And as far as is concerned it has more to do with propaganda war than with reality.As a journalist i have visited various places in afghanistan and know what is truth & what is just the propaganda against Taliban.

  4. #4
    ABW Ambassador Joey's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>And as far as is concerned it has more to do with propaganda war than with reality.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    And your overly dramatized poem wasn't propaganda????

    -Joey :confused:

  5. #5
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Sounded like propaganda to me...

    Also very familiar propaganda at that!

    "Trapped" some Japanese at Pearl Harbor? Even though they were in war planes and our guys were on the ground?!? Come on...

  6. #6
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005

    Come on, it's not about oil! We have as much or more oil available between Texas and Alaska as the rest of the world has put together. If you are not informed enough to understand the reason we are at war then I can not help you. :eek:

  7. #7
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Johnny, the Taliban declared holy war on us. Not the United States not the Army, us. Every male american no matter if you are a male farmer, an infant male child or a male officer in the military service, they want you dead! Dead as a doorstop. Johny, they don't care if you feel sorry for them, or if you love them, or if you hate them, they want you (Johny) and me dead.

    Also for you ladies take a look at to learn what they think of you. These people (the taliban) are the scum of the earth. The want to kill all of us and will do it if they can. None of them sit around crying about dead americans. They celebrate!

    You are a good person, but sometimes it doesn't take good people to make things right.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    The only two problems with we American people:-

    1)Dont admitting our mistakes and blaming others.

    2)Blindly beleiving everything whats told in our media.(about 1 hour after the attack the media started telling us that osama is the key suspect & we started believing until we were completely brainwashed by our media that the attacks were perpetrated by binladen & al-qaeda.After about 200 hours of research done by me & my relative who is in CIA,we firmly came to the conclusion,that all the evidence against binladen & alqaeda was manufactured.And it was Israel's Mosad.)

    And why did binladen became the so-called terrorist.After all he was one of the richest men & could have easily lead a very comfortable life.Again we were responsible for transforming binladen into a terrorist for the two reasons:-

    1)In the very beginning in those old good days,Binladen wrote several letters to our President to withdraw our troops from Saudia Arabia.Because the presence of our troops on most holy places of Muslims was un-islamic.But we didnt listen to him.

    2)Giving state-of-the-art weapons to Israel to kill villagers & children of Palestine.Again we are responsible for these killings of Palestinian civilians.

    I know all of the above will seem radicle to you.But why we & muslims are thinking fundamentally different on this issue.Something in the process must have gone wrong.

    Anyone who has difficulty in assimilating above is advised to do more research on his own(Dont rely on TV & newspaper)

  9. #9
    ABW Ambassador Joey's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The only two problems with we American people:-

    1)Dont admitting our mistakes and blaming others.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Nobody EVER said that all americans are without fault! But the fact is that SOMEBODY is to blame for the acts against us.

    I too have researched almost every side of this story, (including that of the Taliban) and the fact is that they have no interest in making peace with us.

    Let me ask you, when somebody wants you dead, has no intrest in making peace, and is willing to take their own life to kill you, what do you do?


  10. #10
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I too have researched almost every side of this story, (including that of the Taliban) and the fact is that they have no interest in making peace with us.

    Let me ask you, when somebody wants you dead, has no intrest in making peace, and is willing to take their own life to kill you, what do you do?


    There is where the whole fallacie lies.When Taliban were saying that they should be shown the evidence,what was wrong with this.If we can show the evidence to Pakistan,then why not Taliban.Sorry,there are legal procedures for every issue & we didn't follow them.This hypothesis implies that alteast from my viewpoint we didn,t had any interest in making peace with them(Taliban).And by adopting the military option in such a hasty manner ,we have also breached the basic human rights.

    We have been completely brainwashed that Osama did this & Osama did that.I am repeatedly saying that the attrocities of 11th Sep were not committed by Osama or Alqaeda as contrary to what has been projected in the media.This fool-proof plan of hijacking 4 planes simultaneously & flying them through buildings could not have been realized without the active support of elements within our own CIA.When the planes were diverted by their path where was our radar & monitoring system.And where was our security system.Is Alqaeda Or Osama capable of breaking into all of this(radar,monitoring & security system).Surely not.But who else could break it.Yes you guess right... CIA.This attack was a joint venture by Israels secret service Mosaad & our CIA(because they thought that it will be in the long term benefit of US,establishing permanent military bases in Afghanistan so they could be used against China & playing the oil,uranium & natural resources game in Central Asia & toppling the Taliban Government which were looking increasingly dangerous to our interests in Central Asia).

    I hope you understand the dangerous game played by CIA.So dont blame Alqaeda & Osama for 11th September.Surely they are being arrogant.But that is out of context.After all we are also killing their civilians.Is the life of our people who died in WTC any better than 100s of civilians which have been killed by our bombing in Afghanistan.Just think neutrally.CNN was showing the pictures of small innocent babies & children brutally killed by our bombing.Were these children responsible for 11th September?????.One whole village has been disappeared from this earth.I can't tolerate this imperialism anymore.

    [ 10-21-2001: Message edited by: johnny ]

  11. #11
    ABW Ambassador
    Join Date
    January 17th, 2005
    Winterpeg, the Mosquito Capital of Canada
    was gonna rant on about this topic, then thought ....why stoop down to such things???
    Came to conclusion what does this have to do with the theme of this site and why hasn't this topic been taken off the boards instead.

  12. #12
    WW, for what reason should it be deleted?


  13. #13
    ABW Founder Haiko de Poel, Jr.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    New York

    It is a discussion board and it is in the lounge so ... although I have not yet commented on it .... I, obviously, have allowed it.


    What's next the attacks were done by the Masood?

    Yes many things in the name of diplomacy and MUCH less foreign diplomatic relations may not be understood by the lay person but ... it is the big picture we must all look at. At the moment the US has to find, capture and bring to trial Osama Bin Laden .... in the process people will die who stand in the way .... those that pass in Afghanistan are the ones who are against US for anyone with half a brain would have left the country when the Taliban gained ruling power, and If they couldn't then ..... 30 days was MORE than enough notice to GET THE F*CK out .... because America will not stop till The F*CKER is caught or DEAD ..... and the terrorism issue is under control.


  14. #14
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005

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