Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. #1
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Land of The NFL Champs!
    Posts
    2,942
    Are 1/3 of webmasters dishonest?
    I just checked reciprocal links for very much a niche-site. The links were obtained person to person, not through some automatic service either way.

    1/3 of the links are no longer reciprocated, after only 6 mo - 1 year!

    My conclusion: About 1/3 of webmasters are basically scammers. They get my backlink, and then a time later they tear down my link, thus getting a nice one-way link back to their site and eroding my rank. I would guess the majority of these folks would not try any type of scamming that could get them into trouble (like illegal fraud), but I am fairly sure they would steal in other ways if they knew there was no way to get caught.

    This is sad. I am really trying to believe that the odds shake out better among our ranks on this forum. I would guess that among the "regulars" that far far less than 1/3 would do this. Among the "lurkers" however?
    Last edited by Cheesehead; February 11th, 2006 at 07:25 PM.
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  2. #2
    affiliate emeritus missdonna's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Torrance, CA
    Posts
    1,986
    At least some small percentage is probably honest error. They may have had a crash and the only backup they had was from before they added your link.

    I occasionally update and upload an older version of a page by mistake, and lose my recent changes.

    But yes, I'm afraid lots of people will do almost anything they think they can get away with. They know the worst thing you will do is remove their link.
    Affiliate Marketing - The hardest easy money I ever made.

  3. #3
    Life is Supposed to be Fun! Rexanne's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    12,360
    I've never checked my reciprocals - maybe I should. :-) 99% of the sites I link to are lower in rank than my site. They're getting a nice perk. It seems like a pretty silly way to cheat but I guess people have motives most of us wouldn't understand.
    Peace,

    Rexanne

    Rexanne.com
    Loving Everyone's Child Creates Magic


  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    January 22nd, 2005
    Posts
    63
    Currently, with a few exceptions, I generally ignore people requesting link exchanges.

    If I see in my logs a site is sending me real traffic I will check them out when I have time. If the site looks good and safe for my visitors I will give them a link somewhere. If it looks like later they have stopped sending me traffic then I may or may not pull the link.

  5. #5
    Super Sh!t Stirrer SSanf's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Posts
    9,944
    I think I only had one but I don't remember who or where.

    I hope it hasn't gotten lost in the shuffle but it would be very, very easy to do.

    Just not something you think of when regenerating pages and so forth.
    Comments are opinion unless otherwise noted. Remember, pillage first. Then burn. Half of all people in the world have IQs under 100. You best learn to trust ol' SSanf!

  6. #6
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Land of The NFL Champs!
    Posts
    2,942
    Quote Originally Posted by onthepond
    Currently, with a few exceptions, I generally ignore people requesting link exchanges.

    If I see in my logs a site is sending me real traffic I will check them out when I have time. If the site looks good and safe for my visitors I will give them a link somewhere. If it looks like later they have stopped sending me traffic then I may or may not pull the link.
    I disregard most requests these days as well. I do like to trade links with a related site however working with the site owner (rather than some submission service). For one of my sites, one of my link partners sends me as much traffic as Google (perhaps that's not saying that much these days). This partner also has published several articles I have written so it is more than just links. I also provided some extra links back to this partner. With another site I have similar mutually beneficial relationship. Heck, I even gave one party a backlink and insisted they not link back. Sites can work together for mutual benefit. It makes a lot more sense than playing the "backlink game". Slick tricks quickly tire out.
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  7. #7
    What's the word? Rhia7's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 13th, 2006
    Posts
    9,578
    I trade links with "online friends" or people who have e-mailed me expressing a genuine interest in exchanging links (i.e. that webmaster also takes an interest in my site & I take a reciprocal interest)

    I ignore "form letter requests" for links.

    I once had a CGI sign-up to exchange links but I ended up taking that down.
    Some links from the previous sign-up list were difficult to maintain because the webmaster would move the sites without giving me notice or the sites "died" etc...

    If I go into a reciprocal link agreement with another webmaster but that webmaster has not placed a link to my site, I'll remove the link.

    I'll put up "links of interest" which means that I decided to put up the links w/o a reciprocal arrangement or "online friends."
    ~Rhia7 -- Remember the 7
    Twitter me

  8. #8
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Mansfield, TX
    Posts
    16,232
    I've never liked reciprocal links, and always ignore requests for them. If I like a site, I link to it without expecting a link in return. If someone likes my site enough to link to it, that's great. If they won't link to it without a reciprocal link, then they don't like my site enough.
    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com
     Affiliate Tips | Merchant Best Practices | Affiliate Friendly? | Couponing | CPA Networks? | ABW Tips | Activating Affiliates
    "Education is the most powerful weapon which you can use to change the world." Nelson Mandela

  9. #9
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
    Rhea's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    New York, USA
    Posts
    6,195
    I don't do link exchanes with strangers any more. What really burns me though is when someone you know asks for a reciprocal link and then dumps you after a period of time. <koff>

  10. #10
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    St Clair Shores MI.
    Posts
    17,328
    Quote Originally Posted by onthepond
    Currently, with a few exceptions, I generally ignore people requesting link exchanges.

    If I see in my logs a site is sending me real traffic I will check them out when I have time. If the site looks good and safe for my visitors I will give them a link somewhere. If it looks like later they have stopped sending me traffic then I may or may not pull the link.
    DITTO... the tread was being kind to the % of affiliates registered who'd go beyond just using and abusing link exchanges.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

    "What have you done today to put real value into a referral click...from a shoppers viewpoint!"

  11. #11
    ABW Ambassador
    Join Date
    November 26th, 2005
    Posts
    560
    It is likely that many of them are dishonest but it is also likely that some of them have taken down your links unknowingly - there are several factors which can contribute to this.

    also, don't wait six months or a year for the checks - keep checking the links every month or so (you can even automate it) and if you find someone not reciprocating, you can choose either to contact them or take their link down.
    The Best Forums
    Nothing in the world can take the place of persistance
    . Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistance and determination are omnipotent.
    Abestweb Store

  12. #12
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Mansfield, TX
    Posts
    16,232
    Also, I wouldn't say 1/3 of webmasters are dishonest. 1/3 of webmasters seeking reciprocal links, perhaps. But not 1/3 of webmasters.

    When I used an affiliate program to pay PPC to get traffic to my site, about 10% of the affiliates who joined the program were dishonest. (And those 10% could account for 90% of my affiliate traffic at times, although their traffic was worthless.) That's not to say that 10% of affiliates are dishonest. Just 10% of the ones who applied to my program.

    I think the percent who are dishonest is far less than either figure. It's just that they have a far-reaching impact.
    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com
     Affiliate Tips | Merchant Best Practices | Affiliate Friendly? | Couponing | CPA Networks? | ABW Tips | Activating Affiliates
    "Education is the most powerful weapon which you can use to change the world." Nelson Mandela

  13. #13
    Prince of Content Vinny O'Hare's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Posts
    3,126
    The worst is when you check your backlinks and the site that is linked to you is now a porn site with spyware and a million pop ups. Very rare for me to recip links anymore. Besides there is no need for it anyway
    Vinny O'Hare - OPM - Contact Info email: vinny at teamloxly.com ~ 702-582-6742 Twitter

  14. #14
    The Thin White Duke PreacherMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 22nd, 2005
    Posts
    329
    Recip links hold little or no worth for improving ranking nowadays. Waste of time IMO.
    Keep on learning, keep on earning. :fan:

  15. #15
    Member
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Choctaw, Oklahoma
    Posts
    114
    Quote Originally Posted by nyfalcon
    The worst is when you check your backlinks and the site that is linked to you is now a porn site with spyware and a million pop ups. Very rare for me to recip links anymore. Besides there is no need for it anyway
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesehead
    disregard most requests these days as well. I do like to trade links with a related site however working with the site owner (rather than some submission service). For one of my sites, one of my link partners sends me as much traffic as Google (perhaps that's not saying that much these days). This partner also has published several articles I have written so it is more than just links. I also provided some extra links back to this partner. With another site I have similar mutually beneficial relationship. Heck, I even gave one party a backlink and insisted they not link back. Sites can work together for mutual benefit. It makes a lot more sense than playing the "backlink game". Slick tricks quickly tire out.
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelColey
    I've never liked reciprocal links, and always ignore requests for them. If I like a site, I link to it without expecting a link in return. If someone likes my site enough to link to it, that's great. If they won't link to it without a reciprocal link, then they don't like my site enough.
    These three posts say it all, in my opinion. Recip links are the wrong way to go about it. I constantly look for good sites and list them on my sites with a review as a courtesy for my visitors. I'm not about to give a link to site unless it is useful for the visitors to my site.

    If I find a site I want a link from, I write an article for that particular site and approach the webmaster with something of value (content) in exchange for a link. Sometimes they ask for a link back, also, and I give them one in exchange for content from them. Of all the websites I get a response from, my success rate is approximately 60-70%.
    Blessed Be,
    White Wolf

  16. #16
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Land of The NFL Champs!
    Posts
    2,942
    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelColey
    Also, I wouldn't say 1/3 of webmasters are dishonest. 1/3 of webmasters seeking reciprocal links, perhaps. But not 1/3 of webmasters.
    That's probably closer to the truth. And that figure would be reduced a bit to account for webmasters unknowingly removing links or not realizing the impact of removing the link. So the actual figure may be even less. There are some, however, that know what this is all about and play the game to their advantage.
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  17. #17
    The Eternal Optimist zimmy's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    696
    Rhea & Cheesehead - I was scared for a moment...but I still have your links up. phew! Once I put a link up, I just leave it alone. One time I accidently deleted links but tried to rebuild the best I could remember.

    Generally I don't do reciprical links with strangers anymore either. I get lots of requests but just delete them. I feel bad, but most of the time the person hasn't even bothered to look at my site - they will say we are a *good match* when they couldn't be further from the truth.



    ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

    The big shots are only the little shots who keep shooting.
    -Christopher Morley

  18. #18
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    St Clair Shores MI.
    Posts
    17,328
    It's going to get real interesting here at ABW come March when Google takes on all the SEO tricksters. Affiliate SERP spamming from link farms to scraper sites, and even those relying on automatic content generators will be screaming bloody murder. Google is on a jehad for those enities seeking to fool their loyal SE users into clicking worthless revolving door middleman pages. Your customer facing, SERP bot facing pages, best have some unique value in the eyes of the visitor.

    Seems Colin McDougall ( www.veoreport.com ) posted some real insight into Googles next moves to eliminate SE spamming over at that unnamed blogg site. Sanford Univ study on Link spam http://dbpubs.stanford.edu:8090/pub/...me=2005-33.pdf gets mated up with new duplicate content mass detection algorithm to put a triple whammy on link spam, site scrapers and Article spam. Interesting is the adoption by Google and other SE of the prior SE spam eliminator by Sanford Univ named Trustrank http://dbpubs.stanford.edu:8090/pub/...me=2004-52.pdf
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

    "What have you done today to put real value into a referral click...from a shoppers viewpoint!"

  19. #19
    More Cheesier Than Ever Cheesehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Land of The NFL Champs!
    Posts
    2,942
    Quote Originally Posted by ecomcity
    It's going to get real interesting here at ABW come March when Google takes on all the SEO tricksters. Affiliate SERP spamming from link farms to scraper sites, and even those relying on automatic content generators will be screaming bloody murder. Google is on a jehad for those enities seeking to fool their loyal SE users into clicking worthless revolving door middleman pages. Your customer facing, SERP bot facing pages, best have some unique value in the eyes of the visitor.
    I think this may already have started. I get requests from scrapers "we can not find a link back to our site". Yet, we never had a link agreement, the scraper just autogenerated the link and description from my site. This suggests that this type of "content" is being discounted and they are trying to salvage their rankings by getting backlinks.

    Thanks for the concern Zimmy. I don't think I would even take the time to check your site for my link since I know it would be there as you said it would be. The same goes for others on this forum I have traded with.
    This World is Not My Home
    We're gonna go inside, we're gonna go outside, inside and outside. . . And then we're gonna go go go and we're not gonna stop til we get across that goalline! Quotes from the movie Rudy, 1993

  20. #20
    Full Member Tech Evangelist's Avatar
    Join Date
    March 16th, 2005
    Location
    Mesa, AZ
    Posts
    374
    PreacherMan has it right. Reciprocal links have had little or no value for quite some time. It is very easy to determine when sites are exchanging links and they get discounted by the search engines. I wouldn't recommend exchanging links with anyone unless they drive traffic to your site. Very few reciprocal links drive any traffic.

    There is also a very clear downside risk if you link to a site that gets penalized by Google. Quote from Google's Webmaster Guidelines:

    "Don't participate in link schemes designed to increase your site's ranking or PageRank. In particular, avoid links to web spammers or bad neighborhoods on the web, as your own ranking may be affected adversely by those links."

    http://www.google.com/webmasters/guidelines.html

    I've seen sites drop 30 to 50 positions across-the-board because of a single link to a banned site. I get half a dozen requests per week for people either requesting that I link to their site or they want to do a link exchange. IMO, you are completely nuts if you pay any attention to any of these requests. None of these people are trying to do you a favor.
    There's good, fast and cheap. Pick any two.
    [url=http://www.topranksolutions.com]Phoenix SEO[/url] :: [url=http://www.tech-evangelist.com/category/affiliate-marketing/]Affiliate Marketing Tutorials[/url]

  21. #21
    Moderator MichaelColey's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Mansfield, TX
    Posts
    16,232
    I don't care about the value for SEO. I care about the value to my visitors. And reciprocal links provide absolutely no value to my visitors.
    Michael Coley
    Amazing-Bargains.com
     Affiliate Tips | Merchant Best Practices | Affiliate Friendly? | Couponing | CPA Networks? | ABW Tips | Activating Affiliates
    "Education is the most powerful weapon which you can use to change the world." Nelson Mandela

  22. #22
    ABW Ambassador buy_online's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    3,234
    Don't know if it is a third, but I wold say it happens. Like everyone else, I don't do exchanges, except for rare occasions. I guess I stopped about a year ago, when one of my fellow ABWers (a high-poster at that!) took my link down after a couple of months.

    Fred

  23. #23
    Troll Killer and best Snooper!
    I decide when the pigs fly!
    Rhea's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    New York, USA
    Posts
    6,195
    Not to worry, Zimmy, I didn't mean you.

    However, somebody else around here ought to be ashamed of himself.

  24. #24
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Posts
    5,468
    I asked one fellow for a link exchange, and he said, "Sorry, I don't exchange with people who link to porn sites." So I went and checked, sure enough two of my links were now directing to porno sites instead of western fiction.

    What has gotten me a bit puzzled is that a year or two ago, I figured it was a good idea to exchange links with different sites. That is, site A links to site B in exchange for site C linking to site D. That made it inordinantly difficult to check up on who is still linking to where.

    Now, I rarely initiate link exchanges, though if I have a new site, I will try to find two or three other new sites to work with.

    Occasionally I will link to an ABWer's site, or a specific page, just to help them along, if they are not directly competing with me.
    Following everyone else is a GREAT way to become average.

  25. #25
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    St Clair Shores MI.
    Posts
    17,328
    Link to Ecomcity.com as I my sales stats prove I don't compete with anyone here. I'd appreciate finally getting some affiliate, not using 180Solutions or a site scraper, highlighting my site.
    Webmaster's... Mike and Charlie

    "What have you done today to put real value into a referral click...from a shoppers viewpoint!"

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Dishonest merchants, tracking issues or bad luck?
    By perfectG in forum Commission Junction - CJ
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: July 1st, 2003, 04:46 PM
  2. webmasters.com
    By matimer in forum Midnight Cafe'
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: November 5th, 2002, 11:19 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •