Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 36
  1. #1
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    Reversal Horror Stories - Share if you Dare
    It's that time of the month again. It's not yet the 10th, but it looks like most of my CJ merchants have already done their "corrections" (HA! nice euphemism, CJ execs) for May or for the extensions of April. I'm in serious pain right now. If you feel like I do, vent it out here! In my case, the reversal rate is total commission amounts reversed, not the number of commissions reversed.

    Web Hosting merchant:
    (55.6%) Reversals

    Jewelry merchant Which Shall Not Be Named But Which Extends Everything By 30 Days (ergo this is only my *April* reversals, ugh):

    (47.2%) Reversals

    47%?? WHAT, for jewelry?? This company was getting 89% positive ratings on one of those large retail review websites, with thousands of reviews tallied. Admittedly, this is the first month I've actually seen anything actually real (I hope) from them since it's sales from April, not May. 30 day extensions are just cruel, especially if the merchant doesn't care to put ANY reversals into the CJ system until the 10th of the month AFTER the sales have already been extended by 30 days, when they do them all at once. Their AM is going to get some very strongly worded email from me. I do PPC, so I had to go in today and pretty much reduce all my bids by about half for this merchant. This really sucks.

    All my other CJ merchants for May, admittedly not very many with more than a few commissions each:

    0% Reversals


    The jewelry and web hosting were my top commission getters. That is, before they took all the above away from me. I feel like a steaming pile of... oh, there's an emoticon for this. Good thing I only live on the 2nd floor. Looks like I'm going to have to make some major campaign changes, and quick. Any AMs reading this that have practically nonexistent reversals and high conversions? PM me, seriously.

    -mad 'dog

  2. #2
    Newbie jdonisthorpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 28th, 2005
    Posts
    24
    Jewelry Television is reversing 60% of my April sales, which adds up to over $1000 subtraction from my commission. This is the second time this has happened. I'm just not buying it.

  3. #3
    What's the word? Rhia7's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 13th, 2006
    Posts
    9,578
    You want a horror story?

    I once sold a Halloween costume and it was returned

    ~Rhia7 -- Remember the 7
    Twitter me

  4. #4
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    Hahahaha Rhia7. And probably returned AFTER being worn for Halloween.

  5. #5
    What's the word? Rhia7's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 13th, 2006
    Posts
    9,578
    Quote Originally Posted by spacedog
    Hahahaha Rhia7. And probably returned AFTER being worn for Halloween.
    I was bummed out about that. Halloween is a great season
    ~Rhia7 -- Remember the 7
    Twitter me

  6. #6
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    jdonisthorpe,

    I feel your pain. I've searched all over this forum and haven't seen anything negative about Jewelry Television concerning their reversals. In fact, someone posted that they weren't higher than usual for a merchant (I think the words were something like "no big deal, some people return things"). I'd like to get to the bottom of this. See if perhaps it is an anomaly or a huge clerical error, or if something seedy is going on. I'm waiting for their AM's reply.

    You say it's the second time for you. Did you have sales for other months before the two you mention, where reversals were nowhere near this level?

  7. #7
    Full Member kea12345678's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 10th, 2005
    Posts
    203
    I am at about 20% Reversal rate for Jewelry Television.

    I no longer promote them actively.

  8. #8
    Newbie jdonisthorpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 28th, 2005
    Posts
    24
    This is me for the last 6 months. I was a nice quiet affiliate until now.

    Locked Corrected Reversal % Number of Transactions
    Apr 994 1147.37 54% 70
    Mar 649 145 18% 61
    Feb 688 998 59% 75
    Jan 737 139 16% 58
    Dec 255 168 40% 42
    Nov 463 141 23% 66

  9. #9
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    Yikes. Those numbers are all over the map. You'd think that with about 65 transactions each month in your sample, there shouldn't be nearly that much fluctuation.

    Check something else if you have the chance. In all of my transactions that were reversed in which the customer bought more than one item, ALL of the items appear to have been returned so that the entire correction transaction always went to $0.00. In my case, this was in 24 multiple-item reversals. How likely is it that 24 people bought multiple items (a couple were over 10 items!) over the 30 days of April, and all 24 of them returned EVERY SINGLE PIECE for a refund? Doesn't seem plausible. I brought this up in my email to them.

  10. #10

    Join Date
    June 7th, 2006
    Posts
    1,596
    I have, or should say HAD, a debt reduction company on my sites. Along with several other debt companies.

    100% reversal for this company, yet hardly ANY for the other companies I market.

    Needless to say, today I completely dropped them. They kept saying "bogus leads, bad number, bad e-mail". Since I know our traffic is good quality and never had any complaints or problems with other companies I know something was up with these people.

  11. #11
    ABW Veteran Mr. Sal's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Posts
    6,795
    Reversal Horror Stories - Share if you Dare
    I believe that I have being lucky on that category, because I can't remember the last time that I had a reversal on CJ.

    Maybe not selling shoes, or selling on Ebay has something to do with my luck but, .

    And while I still have other issues concerning tracking and conversions, I have not yet had any issue with any Reversals anywhere.
    ...

  12. #12
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    You, Mr. Sal, are one lucky dude. Even some of my lead-based merchants, which I thought would be safe from reversals... no dice. Some lead-only merchants don't seem to check for bogus data or whatever else, while many do and will happily reverse some of them.

  13. #13
    Newbie jdonisthorpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 28th, 2005
    Posts
    24
    Yes, I checked and that is exactly what happened to me. All transactions for the month of April (that's the only month I checked) with multiple item purchase were reversed to zero. That is just plain silly. No return email from JTV, I am going to dig out the business card I got for Christmas from them.

  14. #14
    Life is Supposed to be Fun! Rexanne's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    12,360
    Man, I'd be a very unhappy affiliate marketer if I had reversal numbers like you guys. I'm like Mr. Sal ... no reversals to speak of really. One or 2 here and there but nothing I've ever really noticed in 8 years of AM ... If I did, the merchants in question would be off my pages immediately. That's just too much grief to bear.
    Peace,

    Rexanne

    Rexanne.com
    Loving Everyone's Child Creates Magic


  15. #15
    Newbie jdonisthorpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 28th, 2005
    Posts
    24
    It is worth it for me to pursue this and not just drop them. I have never had a complaint with a merchant or CJ in the past so this is new to me. I still haven't had word from JTV but I did get a response from CJ, which gave me a very warm and fuzzy feeling. Response to the question, "what do I do about this?" is as follows:

    ""Yes what you will do in such a situation is forward a completely comprehensive incident to our Network Quality Department who take this matter s extremely seriously. Provide as much information surrounding the Advertiser and their suspected actions therein. You may submit this once again to our NQ Department through the "Contact Us" Tab on the upper right hand side of your CJ Account Manager.""

  16. #16
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    jdonisthorpe,

    I haven't gotten a response yet, either. I tried both the affiliates@ address and the CJ internal email system. Granted it hasn't been much time yet since I sent it. In a previous post, I think it was Chocolate_Chicken who said that he had more luck sending email to the AM's direct email address than to either of the above. If you find that business card, let me know by PM or publicly, please? I'm going to try to find AM contact info by calling their customer service and I'll let you know.

    There's definitely something wrong if both of our multiple sales are all reversed to $0. Who knows if all affiliates have the same thing happen. If you take a look at prior months' data before April, please let me know if this happened then also.

    I'm curious what actions CJ's Network Quality Department would actually take if they decided a merchant was cheating affiliates. Work to get sales data from the merchant to analyze themselves? I highly doubt it. Force the merchant to refund the affiliates what commissions they are due? Again, I doubt it. Threaten to kick the merchant from CJ?

    I'll work on JTV first, before getting NQ involved. It's certainly possible that the AM is clueless and that this is a new problem. My loss was in the thousands, and I'm not going to just roll over and take it.

  17. #17
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    Rexanne,

    See, that's the problem with merchants who extend sales by 30 days. I don't know if this is the default behavior, but if they wait to put all reversals in the system until the last minue, on the 9th of each month AFTER the extension is through, new affiliates can think they've been doing great with a merchant for up to 60 days before getting hit with the hammer for the first time. Hopefully most merchants actually add reversals to the system periodically as they come in, and not all at the last minute. From other posts, looks like Zappos puts them in periodically which is a lot more fair to us if the merchant suffers from any kind of regular reversal sickness. And with shoes, that totally makes sense. In fact I don't know how a shoe vendor can make it online. I like to try shoes on before buying them. I suspect the vast majority of people do too.

  18. #18
    Life is Supposed to be Fun! Rexanne's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    12,360
    Quote Originally Posted by spacedog
    Rexanne,

    See, that's the problem with merchants who extend sales by 30 days. I don't know if this is the default behavior, but if they wait to put all reversals in the system until the last minue, on the 9th of each month AFTER the extension is through, new affiliates can think they've been doing great with a merchant for up to 60 days before getting hit with the hammer for the first time. Hopefully most merchants actually add reversals to the system periodically as they come in, and not all at the last minute. From other posts, looks like Zappos puts them in periodically which is a lot more fair to us if the merchant suffers from any kind of regular reversal sickness. And with shoes, that totally makes sense. In fact I don't know how a shoe vendor can make it online. I like to try shoes on before buying them. I suspect the vast majority of people do too.
    It certainly would be a problem. I'd tend to run like hell from a merchant who did that even once.

    I have about 4 merchants on CJ who regularly extend all sales to the full 45 days which can be annoying but very few reversals, if any with them. And yeah, shoes seems like such a tough sale online ... I stay away from anything I wouldn't myself purchase online and shoes is one of those things but many people do well selling them so it's certainly viable. I'd imagine the reversal rate on shoes is way high.
    Peace,

    Rexanne

    Rexanne.com
    Loving Everyone's Child Creates Magic


  19. #19
    Newbie jdonisthorpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 28th, 2005
    Posts
    24
    I found the card. JewelryTelevision Carrie Fox, AMM T 865-692-6060 F 865-692-6050 carrie.fox@jtv.com
    I will start with Carrie's email and see how far I get.

  20. #20
    What's the word? Rhia7's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 13th, 2006
    Posts
    9,578
    Quote Originally Posted by spacedog
    ...And with shoes, that totally makes sense. In fact I don't know how a shoe vendor can make it online. I like to try shoes on before buying them. I suspect the vast majority of people do too.
    If you try on the shoes on a rug in your home, the shoes will be salable quality (if they must be returned).

    I've ordered shoes online because it's not always easy to get my size, but I do know my size. Often I'll order a pair of shoes I already know that I like.

    Shoes online can work ... it's the same as buying shoes from a catalog.
    ~Rhia7 -- Remember the 7
    Twitter me

  21. #21
    The slot machine that IS paid! Billy Kay's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 18th, 2005
    Location
    Small Town in Tennessee
    Posts
    5,226
    I had a $280,000.00 reversal - which is why I'm not writing this from Tahiti

  22. #22
    What's the word? Rhia7's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 13th, 2006
    Posts
    9,578
    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Kay
    I had a $280,000.00 reversal - which is why I'm not writing this from Tahiti
    On shoes? What type of goods?
    ~Rhia7 -- Remember the 7
    Twitter me

  23. #23
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    Cripes, $280K?? If that's a reversal, I can only imagine what kind of revenue you're getting.

  24. #24
    Verbosely Virtuous Mutt spacedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 8th, 2006
    Posts
    652
    jdonisthorpe,

    Thanks a lot for the info. I'll try the email and phone channels both, and I'll let you know.

  25. #25
    ABW Ambassador MoneyBusiness's Avatar
    Join Date
    March 14th, 2006
    Posts
    2,051
    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Kay
    I had a $280,000.00 reversal - which is why I'm not writing this from Tahiti

    Is it possible that they reversed it, otherwise they'd go bankrupt????

    Good luck with that.
    Follow my dog, Maya, and I, as we fumble around the affiliate marketing world: www.MarketingMaya.com
    Recent Project: Cheap Personal Checks (using DigitalQuill)

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. PayPal horror stories
    By getit in forum Merchant Best Practices Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: February 2nd, 2010, 07:25 PM
  2. Affiliate Summit Travel Horror Stories
    By Rexanne in forum Events and Gatherings
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: August 3rd, 2007, 11:55 AM
  3. The Worst Reversal Horror Storie?
    By MicroMag in forum Commission Junction - CJ
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: September 1st, 2006, 02:26 AM
  4. A few horror stories, please.
    By US Beast in forum Introduce Yourself
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: October 26th, 2005, 06:53 AM
  5. Replies: 12
    Last Post: August 19th, 2004, 01:42 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •