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  1. #1
    Action Jackson - King of the World
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    Due to the recent problems ABW has been having I thought it would be a good idea to get everyone's opinions on what they feel ABW needs to function more peaceably and also more effectively. Think about all aspects of ABW including the different sections of the forum and possible rules you believe should be enforced. Long live ABW!

  2. #2
    ABW Ambassador
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    Liquor brought to my door.

  3. #3
    ABW Ambassador
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    'lectric shock treatments for the spasmodics and thread offenders [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    Action Jackson - King of the World
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    could we have some serious comments please

  5. #5
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    None of my business. (And this is a very serious comment)

    - BluesX

  6. #6
    ABW Adviser Panel Dynamoo's Avatar
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    Speaking as a mod for some of the other ABW topics I'd suggest a "no flame wars" rule. Freedom of speech, debate and reasoned argument is important but personal attacks should not be tolerated.. threads should be not just locked but messages deleted and persistent offenders booted.

    Flame wars don't help anyone and they just lead to bad feelings.

  7. #7
    Action Jackson - King of the World
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    I agree. To me being disrespectful to any other person here shouldn't be tolerated. This is Haiko's board. He makes the rules and everyone should follow them. Ask yourself this: Where would ABW be if it wasn't for Haiko?

    P.S. I want to clarify that this thread is for constructive criticism and a means to get your views heard by everyone. This is not a place for spamming responses or rude comments. If I see any of these things, the thread will be closed.

  8. #8
    Resident Genius and Staunch Capitalist Leader's Avatar
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    Jack--first off, the correct statement is if a moderator sees flames starting here, the thread will be closed.

    As for the question at hand, Dynamoo has already hit the main point.

    I also think the other rules at ABW should be enforced.

  9. #9
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    I don't think anybody should be Banned for any reason. Makes it kinda hard to express you feelings,concerns or things that have happen to you with an advertiser good or bad without having to worry about being Banned or your post edited.

    Who would want to post anything with this Banned idea hanging over your head with every key stroke, I'm sure newbies are scared to post anything.

    Flame wars to me just seem to be an everyday thing in life, I don't mind reading them, It's kinda makes this board interesting, to watch the battle of wits in Action.

    Find something here that you think should'nt be posted, Don't read it or comment move On.

    Advertisers come here to talk with affiliates and put a little boost in their programs that's great, but everybody is not going to be happy with their program. Deal with the good and the bad posts don't just edit or delete posts, because you want the perfect world. And I'm sure with every bad posts there are 10 good posts so what are you worried about, have faith in your program...

  10. #10
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    FREE SPEECH
    VIVRE LA LIBRE [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

  11. #11
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    Speaking from both sides of the fence - I would agree "no flame wars"

    On the issue of banning people, that is one that is really hard for me.
    On one hand, I would hate for a disagreement on a messageboard to affect someone's ability to do business. And because I think ABW is such a vital part of doing business, I would hate to see anyone "blackballed"

    On the other hand, I think some people are just disruptive and will never changed. And that hurts everyone's ability to "get down to business"

    So for me banning is a hard question. But I think that Haiko and the moderators have handled things well. I think the way they have a cooling off period is also a good idea. That way people have time to back off, go out and engage life and get some perspective.

    All that being said, I think any messageboard is going to have "growing pains"

    Vicki [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

  12. #12
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Leader:
    Jack--first off, the correct statement is if a moderator sees flames starting here, the thread will be closed.

    As for the question at hand, Dynamoo has already hit the main point.

    I also think the other rules at ABW should be enforced.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I agree with Dynamoo and Leader and would add:

    1. More respect by ABW members for the other members and Mods

    2. More respect by ABW members for the purpose of this board.

    3. More respect by ABW members for Haiko and his User Agreement

    4. No tolerance for those who would undermine Haiko, the moderators, and the ABW by repeatedly stirring up trouble.

    5. As for free speech - My dad used to say "NOT as long as your living under MY roof and I'm paying the bills! So long as you're here, what I say GOES" This is Haiko's roof. If it weren't for him we'd all be out in the cold. He pays the bills. He makes the rules. If you want to stay - obey. If not, you know where the door is.

    There are plenty of places on the internet where you can spew venom and bicker with each other all you want. That's not the purpose of A Best Web. The purpose of A Best Web is for affiliates and merchants to learn how to be affiliates and merchants, for us to help each other, not attack each other. There's a big difference between constructive, professional debate, and the kind of crap that has been going on here for the past few weeks.

    {

    [ 07-31-2002: Message edited by: eaglefire ]

  13. #13
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    1- This is not Haiko's house

    2- Haiko and Mods need to handle things more carefully as ABW may mean more than a message board to many business people

    3- ABW is not a chit-chat place. Business is conducted here and Nobody owns it {edited to clarify that I refer the conducted business here, not to ABestWeb.com}. Haiko is I am sure compensated for his efforts via several partnerships with ABW friendly merchants.

    4- If the boards will be moderated, should be done 100% to the set rules. Since the boards ARE moderated, nobody should be out to defend free speech

    5- Moderators should not ask for respect. Nobody is obliged to be here and nobody is most importantly served by moderators. The concept moderation needs to be studied.

    6- If this monarchy goes on here, I am afraid ABW will lose some of its strength in the Affiliate Marketing industry.

    Respectfully,

    - BluesX

    [ 07-31-2002: Message edited by: BluesX ]

  14. #14
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If this monarchy goes on here, I am afraid ABW will lose some of its strength in the Affiliate Marketing industry.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    <IMG src=http://www.abestweb.com/ubb/icons/icon14.gif> <IMG src=http://www.abestweb.com/ubb/icons/icon14.gif> Agree !!! goto hell Dictator !!!

  15. #15
    Defender of Truth, Justice and the Affiliate Way
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    **My <IMG src=http://www.abestweb.com/ubb/icons/icon26.gif> and my opinions only**

    I think that the rule of thumb of not typing anything that you wouldn't say to someone if you were face to face goes a long way towards productive discourse between members. Also keeping in mind when reading a post (or writing a post)that the written word can open it's self to misunderstanding over the spoken word. You lose all those nonverbal communication signals like facial expressions, body language, and tone of voice.

    But the bottom line is that this is a moderatedboard. I knew that when I signed up. Utimately, it is all Haiko's decision. He can run this board anyway he pleases and do whatever he wishes with it. He can enforce his rules or not. He can have whatever rules he wants. He can selectively enforce his rules if he wants. He can choose whoever he wants as moderators. He can ban whoever he wants for whatever reason he wants (including me). It's each members on personal decision if this board fits their own personal style and what they are looking for in this type of board. I joined this board voluntarily. I'm the one who controls my mouse button as to whether or not I'm going to come here. When I come here it's because I've made the choice that this is an environment I want to participate in under Haiko's rule.

    For clarity, I'm not saying that Haiko does or does not do any of the above things. I'm just saying he has the right to do whatever he wants. Then it's up to me to decide if I want to be here.

    At least there is a suggestions forum where members can post with regards to how this board is run.

    Personally, I don't like flame wars and feel they serve not purpose whatsoever. The lack of such (at least when I joined the boards) was one of the things that attracted me here. But I'm a Pices, so I like harmony. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] But some people thrive off of them. Who am I to say? It's up to me to find a community that meets my needs and I feel comfortable with. So far, that has been the case at ABW.

    Guess that was my 10 cents worth. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

  16. #16
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    Originally posted by BluesX:
    >> This is not Haiko's house <<

    On the contrary. He pays the bills. Whether he is deservedly compensated by some members or not is immaterial. My clients pay me. It does not mean they own my business.


    >>Haiko and Mods need to handle things more carefully as ABW may mean more than a message board to many business people <<

    I agree 100% !

    >> ABW is not a chit-chat place. Business is conducted here and Nobody owns it. Haiko is I am sure compensated for his efforts via several partnerships with ABW friendly merchants. <<

    Once again I agree - as per responses to #1 and #2 above.


    >> If the boards will be moderated, should be done 100% to the set rules. Since the boards ARE moderated, nobody should be out to defend free speech <<

    Again I agree 100%! Rules should definietly be enforced. You are right this is not the Floor of the Senate or any political platform for free speech.


    >> Moderators should not ask for respect. Nobody is obliged to be here and nobody is most importantly served by moderators. The concept moderation needs to be studied. <<

    Everyone is deserving of respect and has the right to ask for it. I will also add that no moderator here is compensated for being a moderator. I refer you also to the User Agreement in the announcement forum regarding Board Moderation.


    >> If this monarchy goes on here, I am afraid ABW will lose some of its strength in the Affiliate Marketing industry. <<


    On the contrary, if all hell continues to be allowed to break loose, ABW will continue to lose strength in the Industry and eventually cease to exist.


    Haiko - you are doing a great job
    <IMG src=http://www.abestweb.com/ubb/icons/icon14.gif>

    {

    [ 07-31-2002: Message edited by: eaglefire ]

  17. #17
    Domain Addict / Formerly known as elbowcreek Thomas A. Rice's Avatar
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    Haiko is well within his rights to ban individuals, and I personally think that, on the few times he has had to come through with one it has improved the quality of the posts on the board.

    Nobody likes being harassed, and the simple truth is that, occaisionally, one will encounter an individual who believes that belittling your ideas and insulting you is considered intellectual discusison.

    Without the threat of banishment, the effectiveness of this board could be dramatically lowered by one or two individuals.

    Which is, by the way, a 180 degree about face from my previous posts, lol: Gotta keep him on his heels, doncha know.
    [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

  18. #18
    Defender of Truth, Justice and the Affiliate Way
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BluesX:
    [QB]1- This is not Haiko's house

    2- Haiko and Mods need to handle things more carefully as ABW may mean more than a message board to many business people

    3- ABW is not a chit-chat place. Business is conducted here and Nobody owns it {edited to clarify that I refer the conducted business here, not to ABestWeb.com}. Haiko is I am sure compensated for his efforts via several partnerships with ABW friendly merchants.

    4- If the boards will be moderated, should be done 100% to the set rules. Since the boards ARE moderated, nobody should be out to defend free speech

    5- Moderators should not ask for respect. Nobody is obliged to be here and nobody is most importantly served by moderators. The concept moderation needs to be studied.

    6- If this monarchy goes on here, I am afraid ABW will lose some of its strength in the Affiliate Marketing industry.

    Respectfully,

    - BluesX

    [QB]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I respectfully disagree. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] If this was a paid membership board, then I would agree with those statements. But it's not. It's a service provided to us by Haiko. It's his website. I don't see the connection to whether or not he gets compensated. Or the fact that business is done here. We all make money (hopefully) off of our websites, but do we think anyone else has the right to tell us how to run our site? Why is ABW any different?

    I think it's great that Haiko does take feedback from his members and listens to them. But he's under no obligation to do that. It makes good business sense to try and keep the masses happy, but he doesn't have to.

    Again, just my opinions.

  19. #19
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    > Why is ABW any different?

    Message boards are not websites. One person can not make a dime out of a message board. Message boards are communities formed by willing individuals who consent to contribute to message board owner's business. Besides, ABW is not just any message board and I am really disgussed to see that it is run like any oher. Why is it not any other? Because it did not go from 0 to 1 by itself and as I mentioned somewhere else, going from 0 to 1 is the half the way. I am disgussed to see that pwople who helped ABW go from 0 to 1 are being banned, insulted, blamed for etc...


    >I think it's great that Haiko does take feedback from his members and listens to them. But he's under no obligation to do that. It makes good business sense to try and keep the masses happy, but he doesn't have to.

    Agree, but I don't think Haiko is listening any of this. He is acting at his own will and at his own decision. He is out of lines sometimes when he tries to be more than what he is supposed to be for the industry.

    (i.e., eBates will be addressed, me thinks! well, Haiko is one man and without the ABestWeb support, he can not reach to any industry chief and talk about ebates)


    >Again, just my opinions.

    Yup... my opinions and my criticism :cool:

    (ops, forgot to sign!)

    - BluesX

    [ 07-31-2002: Message edited by: BluesX ]

  20. #20
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    All good stuff, but with one minor change - no deleting messages unless they have illegal content. They are far too important for, um, research.

    Perhaps they should be hived off somewhere - a flame forum (I like those) and perhaps certain people should be confined there.

    You could have those threads not show on Todays Active Topics, to protect the delicate, while I could view them and so could anyone else with an interest. I'm often just as offended as everyone else is - but by the inordinately content, in my case.


    I

  21. #21
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    I agree. I think it's important to leave them available. I don't think there've been any deleted threads or posts, save one that was apparently deleted while I was sleeping Sunday night (dernit!).

    Usually they are just moved out of sight to cool off for a bit, then re-instated.

  22. #22
    2005 Linkshare Golden Link Award Winner  ecomcity's Avatar
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    Haiko does rule this board and his passion on vital subjects makes his opinions more meaningful than the flaming pissing contests. I ignor these personal battles since I joined ABW and will continue to ignor them. I love being able to devulge what works to make merchants cut checks to affiliates. I also relish the opportunity the ABW forum presents to highlight merchant and network abuses of the stacked system.

    While banning disruptive posters is often necessary it should be the exception and all posters should think of some benefit to others for every post they make. We have a long way to go before the merchants and networks treat and compensate us as the premium advertising/sales channel for generating sales. We truly are the only viable targeting force for advertisers when they earn the right to be showcased by our web sites.

    ABW has become the watchdog for a corrupt industry that monitizes all forms of parasites-scumware -con-men and spammers. Let's not dilute our impact on fucusing on the abuses/abusers by petty bickering over personalized attacks. A few here earn their right by the good they perform to boot out those who disrupt the mission of ABW. Haiko is one of these.

  23. #23
    ABW Ambassador
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    Bottom Line ...

    It is what it is ... Read the rules ...

    If you dont like them and cant live with them ... You can exercise your right to ...

    LEAVE [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]


    Dave

  24. #24
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    I think ABW needs 100 new threads that focus on Affiliate Marketing and not on ABW.

  25. #25
    Content $ Queen Ebudae's Avatar
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Agree, but I don't think Haiko is listening any of this. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I disagree. Haiko does listen.

    There have been many times that I contacted him off this board to ask a question, voice my concerns, ask for help, or to discuss something when I didn't want to take the matter publically to the messageboard. He has always been honest with me even when I was in the wrong or mistaken - and he always listened.

    I think a lot of people don't realize how much time he puts in both on the board as well as helping and advising off the board.

    Vicki [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

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