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  1. #1
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    Has anyone calculated the percentage of returns to their total sales in August, now that the sales are finalized? We are getting around 45% which is dismal at best, the worst month ever with Zappos. Strange thing is we rarely have any returns with any of our other shoe partners...zero usually and all of the large sales were reversed, by some strange coincidence.

  2. #2
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    I'm showing a reversal rate of close to 50% for August, HOWEVER, to their credit, this is based on 6 reversals out of a total of 36 transactions. 4 sales out of those 6 all came through on the same day in August, one right after another, and were reversed as "returned merchandise". Based on how the sales looked on my end that day, I fully expected those specific 4 to be reversed since they did appear to be fraudulent orders. If I take those 4 out of the picture, our reversal rate comes in at 13%, which is well below Zappos usual reversal rate and network average.

    Overall, I give them 2 thumbs up, they've done great for me over the past couple of years! I'll take a few reverals from them if they keep converting the way they have been!

  3. #3
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    Unless the consequetive sales were the exact same dollar value there is nothing really unusual about this...In fact, the very fact that you mention the status is because the were "returned merchandise" would denote otherwise. So they were not fraud.

    So you really cannot take those out of the equation, which would put your rate about where mine is, which makes good sense. If you look at the chart at CJ, you will see an increase in the bar from July to August to September, slightly each month, but definitely climbing.

    I for one have also noticed less sales, by far this month over last. Conversion is down and EPC is down as well to go along with this theory...

    In the past, I am with you, they have converted well and EPC was up and returns were much lower. It seems that over the past month and a half all these figures have headed for the worse...the part that concerns me about this is that there return percentage is over 3 times higher than other shoe stores and that the EPC has slid over the past two months...over what should be a good shoe sale time...

  4. #4
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    Maybe, I'm not sure I agree with your logic though. Why would someone post 4 different orders one after another if they were legit? More likely, some kid grabed Daddy's credit card, ordered a bunch of stuff. It worked, ordered some more, again and again. Everything arrived, daddy found out, and made them send everything back. Thus, the merchandise was returned.

    Not saying this is definitely what happened, but my point is, its plausible, and given the fact that most other sales for the month didn't get reversed means I'm not all that concerned about these 4, unless a trend develops which I haven't seen yet from my data.

  5. #5
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    Well considering the fact that they were not returned for "fraud" or any suspicous reason and they were not identical sales dollars and considering the fact that your return ratio is 50% for legitimate reasons...and considering that other sites such are ours are at 45%, which is very close to your 50%...I would say it is proving to be a trend as opposed to a fluke.

    In any case, whether or not it was returned as you said or they were just simply returned, those types of things are factored into the average chargeback percentage already as zappos has been around the CJ network for a while. With this said, it is not a good trend to be starting and it will certainly scew the stats if this happens this month.

    Now I would be interested in seeing other return percentages too...perhaps we are the exception?

  6. #6
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    Not long ago I had a very large order reversed with (a different merchant than Zappos). They told me they declined an order for fifty pairs of sandals to Nigeria!

  7. #7
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    from over 20 sales i just got 1 reversal. great month with zappos. now all was locked

  8. #8
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    about 40% here [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif[/img]

    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
    - Thomas Jefferson

  9. #9
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    Sorry for the second post but I just wanted to add that Shoebuy.com a befree merchant though having a much smaller selection and crappy outdated links outsells zappos by about 20% and I've never had a reversal from them.

    They aren't perfect esp with their quarterly payment schedule but I think it's time to push them into the spotlight.

    I made the mistake of replacing them with zappos on my sites and now I pay the price.

    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
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  10. #10
    ABW Ambassador Abigail's Avatar
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    Has anybody seen the Aug batch uploads yet from Zappos?

    Abigail

  11. #11
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    >Has anybody seen the Aug batch uploads yet from Zappos?

    What seems here is that Zappos did not batch the partial credits in August. The news is though, it was done voluntarily by Zappos, CJ reporting requirements do not enforce such action. So Zappos may have decided to keep that portion of earnings to themselves and lose the good faith of affiliates in return.

    My reversal rate for August is in line of what it has been. Around 35%.

    - BluesX

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  12. #12
    ABW Ambassador Abigail's Avatar
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    I just shot off an email to Jack at Zappos maybe he can answer the question for us.

    Abigail

  13. #13
    Crazy Cat Lady Heidi's Avatar
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    I had 4 out of 6 sales reversed for August - Ouch!

    Heidi
    Fit2a-t: The Center of the T-shirt Universe!

  14. #14
    Affiliate Manager Lionstail's Avatar
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    Four sales, one of them reversed. Not enough to be all that significant statistically, but 25% reversals is not horrible. Dave

  15. #15
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    To open this up a bit, I am going to correct a misconception...The Reversal percentage is based on the dollar of reversed shoes compared to the total dollar value of all shoes sold in a month (in this case we are talking about August)...

    So to be accurate the percentage is not based on a number of sales to number of sales reversed, but the dollar value of the sales reversed compared to the dollar value of total sales made...

    This is the only true way to calculate this...sheer number of sales can be grossly inaccurate as you could have had a $600 sale reversed with only four sales, which typically average $80...

  16. #16
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    Yes sales I just did some figures for august.

    38% of my sales were reversed leaving me with an effective zappos commission rate of 9.45%

    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
    - Thomas Jefferson

  17. #17
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    Reversal rate for August is 23% based on sales amount, and that's after the batched partial credits.

  18. #18
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    quote:

    I just wanted to add that Shoebuy.com a befree merchant though having a much smaller selection and crappy outdated links outsells zappos


    Incidently, both Zappos and Shoebuy are Morpheus merchants.

    Shoes.com - an ABW merchant who has also taken a proactive step in doing away with reversals that are not fraudulent CC's - is not a Morpheus merchant.

    {

    "Laziness, Impatience, Hubris. Pick any three" ~ YAPC 19100

  19. #19
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    Zappos reported that August was a record month for low reversal rates. My stats are right in line with that. I had 141 transactions and a reversal rate of 24% for august. Normally I get a reversal rate of right around 35% with them.

    If we don't get some kool rules ourselves...... pronto........ then we'll just be bogus too.. ~Jeff Spicoli~

  20. #20
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    I could use some help with this decision.

    Zappos offers 15% commission and after their horrible reversal rate their effective commission is 9%. At the same time they convert sales to get an epc of 17 dollars.

    On the other hand shoes.com pays 10% and has less then 5% rcversal rate leaving them with an effective commission of over 9%. Their epc however is only 6 dollars.


    It looks to me when only considering the numbers a person should make more money with zappos because zappos converts nearly three times the sales.

    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
    - Thomas Jefferson

  21. #21
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    >It looks to me when only considering the numbers a person should make more money with zappos because zappos converts nearly three times the sales.

    It is the inventory issue. Zappos manages to offer a whole lot better selection than any other shoe store, but at such a high reversal rate that brings their effective commission rate to under 10%, it would really make sense trying other places to see if your sales can be sustained at that level.

    In the meantime, I have seen a huge drop in Zappos sales this month. Jack claims their sales are doing well, there must be a huge peak in Morpheus-stolen sales.

    - BluesX

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  22. #22
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    I promote both and I am trying to make the same decision Heyder. If it was simply a matter of EPC and reversals, it would be tougher, but for me it would be Shoes.com hands down because sales are way down with Zappos this month no doubt because of pilfering. I'd rather have an effective 9% of something than 9% of 0%, or I should say rather than giving away 9% to someone who hasn't worked for it.

    {

    "Laziness, Impatience, Hubris. Pick any three" ~ YAPC 19100

  23. #23
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    Yes Zappos sales are at an all time low for me so I'm to assume this is stolen sales not just sh*t luck.

    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
    - Thomas Jefferson

  24. #24
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    I also have a big drop in Zappos sales this month , perhaps people don't wear shoes in the last month of Summer?! As far as changing merchant is concerned, I thought of it, but never got around to do it.

  25. #25
    ABW Veteran Student Heyder's Avatar
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    quote:
    Mike,

    We have no relationship with Morpheous. I have submitted your concern to CJ. I''d sure like to know what, if anything underhanded, is going on.

    Jack



    "I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have."
    - Thomas Jefferson

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