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  1. #1
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Check Your Liberties at the Stadium, Too
    I had just read Noth's post on this subject when I received a call from a friend in NY. A few months ago, he retired and moved to NY to spend his retirement years watching his beloved Yankees. He told me about somethng that happens at every game at Yankee Stadium, that I just could not believe, but I found a NY Times article the bears it out, with a photo, no less.

    The NY Yankees, in their efforts to force patriotism on their fans, not only do not allow fans to leave their seats during the playing of the National Anthem before games and during the playing of God Bless America during the 7th-inning strech, but they go so far as to put up chains, preventing fans from moving about.

    No bathroon visits, no trips to concession stands, no going home!

    Here is the article, and photo:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/10/sp...rssnyt&emc=rss

    Many years ago at Dodger Stadium, when Walter O'Malley was still alive, concessionaires would stop work during the playing of the National Anthem, but this is just too extreme to be acceptable.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffiliateHound

    Many years ago at Dodger Stadium, when Walter O'Malley was still alive, concessionaires would stop work during the playing of the National Anthem, but this is just too extreme to be acceptable.
    For the Star Spangled Banner
    I may lead a sheltered life, but from my perspective, I think that this is standard procedure at places where I have attended events. This action is just being respectful like stand up, face the flag and remove your hat.

    For God Bless America....................It's just another song.

    I think any obstruction to people leaving a place is a violation of fire safety regulations. In the situation that you previously described(chains,etc), if someone gets hurt, they or their attorney will own the stadium.
    Last edited by Witzer; May 26th, 2007 at 10:28 PM.
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  3. #3
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witzer
    I may lead a sheltered life, but from my perspective, I think that this is standard procedure at places where I have attended events. This action is just being respectful like stand up, face the flag and remove your hat.
    I've been to sports events at MANY other stadiums, including every LA & Orange County venue, including Anaheim Stadium, LA Coliseum, Fabulous Forum, Pauley Pavillion, LA Sports Arena, Arrowhead Pond (now Honda), Rose Bowl, plus many others in other cities, and I don't recall seeing that anywhere else. Of course, I'm almost always in my seat before the game starts, and not in line, so I might be missing it. And, the Dodgers stopped the stoppage in the late 1970s or early 1980s, I believe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Witzer
    I think any obstruction to people leaving a place is a violation of fire safety regulations. In the situation that you previously described(chains,etc), if someone gets hurt, they or their attorney will own the stadium.
    The article quotes NY Fire officials as saying it's ok so long as ushers are holding the chains, and they are not fastened to anything.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffiliateHound
    The article quotes NY Fire officials as saying it's ok so long as ushers are holding the chains, and they are not fastened to anything.
    This is correct as described above.

    My misinterpretation. I thought that you were talking about the "hawkers" in the stands.................Yes, activities away from the flag view area generally do not stop.
    You must climb this mountain. There is no elevator. ---- Don't stick your finger in the liquid nitrogen.
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  5. #5
    Analytics Dude Kevin's Avatar
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    Still though, being forced to observe either song in "motionless" silence is a little... odd?
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  6. #6
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noth
    Still though, being forced to observe either song in "motionless" silence is a little... odd?
    You can always sing along.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noth
    Still though, being forced to observe either song in "motionless" silence is a little... odd?
    Why feel forced? It is a reminder of patriotic respect.

    I think that you will find that standing and facing the flag when the national anthem is being played is a concept that is honored world wide.
    You must climb this mountain. There is no elevator. ---- Don't stick your finger in the liquid nitrogen.
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  8. #8
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Witzer, the big problem with that is about 85% of the time, the "artist" performing the Anthem is so bad, and the rendition bears so little resemblance to the original, that it is torture to listen.

    A real performance of The Star Spangled Banner by an artist with a great voice is a spine-tingling event.

    But, under no circumstances should paying customers to a sports event be forced to stand and listen when they desparetly need to run to the restroom.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
    "If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?" -John Wooden;
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffiliateHound
    Witzer, the big problem with that is about 85% of the time, the "artist" performing the Anthem is so bad, and the rendition bears so little resemblance to the original, that it is torture to listen.
    I certainly agree with that............
    So torture is legal after all???
    You must climb this mountain. There is no elevator. ---- Don't stick your finger in the liquid nitrogen.
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  10. #10
    ABW Ambassador simcat's Avatar
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    Thread reminds me of a player we had here in D-Town for awhile.

    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/sport...bate_3-14.html

  11. #11
    Prince of Content Vinny O'Hare's Avatar
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    I doubt any fans in Yankee Stadium want to go to the restrom during God Bless America. Here in Ny they don't even go to a commercial on tv until after God Bless America is played.

    You can ask the usher and they let you out for the restroom, it isn't as bad as the article makes it out to be.
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  12. #12
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyfalcon
    I doubt any fans in Yankee Stadium want to go to the restrom during God Bless America. Here in Ny they don't even go to a commercial on tv until after God Bless America is played.

    You can ask the usher and they let you out for the restroom, it isn't as bad as the article makes it out to be.
    According to my friend (#1 above): No, the ushers WILL NOT let you through to go to the restroom, but if you even tried, other fans would tear you apart.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  13. #13
    Lite On The Do, Heavy On The Nuts Donuts's Avatar
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    Most adults can plan their potty breaks - this whole argument here seems contrived to me.

    The things I've seen and heard from yankees fans down in the Tampa Bay Devil Rays stadium tell me our liberties are very much alive and well in America!

  14. #14
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    Most adults can plan their potty breaks - this whole argument here seems contrived to me.

    The things I've seen and heard from yankees fans down in the Tampa Bay Devil Rays stadium tell me our liberties are very much alive and well in America!
    And most fans plan their potty breaks for in between innings, and the best inning break for potty or concessions is the long 7th inning, so as not to miss any of the game. Not every fan is a season ticket holder who is aware that they will be prevented from going out after the top of the seventh.

    Chains preventing egress does not equal liberty. But, it is not governmental action, but policy carried out by a billionaire owner with a captive audience of lemmings who see nothing wrong with this absurd conduct.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  15. #15
    Lite On The Do, Heavy On The Nuts Donuts's Avatar
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    Most lemmings in the stadium would like all the non-lemmings to sit still for just a minute or so while we honor our country in a unified, dignified manner. We know it's a lot to ask of you non-lemmings, planning your urine releases out more than two minutes in advance - but we feel asking you to have a little structure in your life for our sakes, just this once, might be good for you too. If you'd like, sit and stew quietly about how much you hate America and its absurd billionaire oppressors - that is your right. You may also want to ignore the requested pause in comotion and flail your arms about wildly and scream "lemmings" the the top of your lungs while the rest of us perform our ritual you've called absurd (we'll see which of us can get on the news for being strange).

    They are not restraining anyone or preventing egress, your lashing out at the "billionaire" and trying to portray it as being chained up and removing our liberties, tells me you've been reading far, far too much Huxley.

  16. #16
    Prince of Content Vinny O'Hare's Avatar
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    You can get up and go to the restroom without a problem, maybe your buddy was rude to the usher or something.

    BTW don't believe everything you read in the nytimes.
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  17. #17
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    Most lemmings in the stadium would like all the non-lemmings to sit still for just a minute or so while we honor our country in a unified, dignified manner.
    That happens before every game in every other stadium for the National Anthem, without the need for chains.

    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    We know it's a lot to ask of you non-lemmings, planning your urine releases out more than two minutes in advance - but we feel asking you to have a little structure in your life for our sakes, just this once, might be good for you too.
    Not me, but I know people in my age group and a bit older with medical problems, including my wife, who has severe nerve damage in her spine (12 spinal surgeries and is in a wheelchair) who when they have to go, HAVE TO GO NOW.

    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    If you'd like, sit and stew quietly about how much you hate America and its absurd billionaire oppressors - that is your right.
    That is ridiculous. I'll "sit and stew" no more about this than about how the Patriot Act and other actions by those in power have abrogated some of the rights that we fought to win in 1776, and to protect in 1917 and 1941. But we have elected these people to run our country as they see fit. That a private individual, just because he has the economic power to do so, can also abridge basic rights, is, in the grand scheme of things, a minor issue, but still a matter that some of us think is just plain wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    You may also want to ignore the requested pause in comotion and flail your arms about wildly and scream "lemmings" the the top of your lungs while the rest of us perform our ritual you've called absurd (we'll see which of us can get on the news for being strange).
    I am not saying that anyone should not stand and observe the performance of any patriotic song. That is not what I called absurd. What is absurd is prohibiting freedom of movement by paying fans, and that includes that period of time between the last out of the top of the seventh and the first note of God Bless America - usually enough time to sprint up the asle, at least in other venues.

    The NY Times article (regardless of what nyfalcon thinks about the Times) shows what makes the news as "strange".

    Quote Originally Posted by Donuts
    They are not restraining anyone or preventing egress, your lashing out at the "billionaire" and trying to portray it as being chained up and removing our liberties, tells me you've been reading far, far too much Huxley.
    Actually, it's been years. Maybe I''ll pull one out and read some tonight.

    Quote Originally Posted by nyfalcon
    ... maybe your buddy was rude to the usher or something.
    Entirely possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by nyfalcon
    You can get up and go to the restroom without a problem,..
    They why have the chains?
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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  18. #18
    ABW Ambassador meadowmufn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffiliateHound
    What is absurd is prohibiting freedom of movement by paying fans
    When you buy your tickets to attend the game, you accept their rules. If you don't like their rules, don't go to their stadium. It's as simple as that. It's their business to run as they please.
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  19. #19
    Affiliate Manager MINDsprinter's Avatar
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    It would be a mistake to make more out of this than it is (as the NYTimes has done). This is silly. Maybe it should be stopped, but really, its just silly IMO.
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  20. #20
    Super Dawg Member Phil Kaufman aka AffiliateHound's Avatar
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    Issue Revolved in Court: Fans Win, Fans Win
    Follow-Up:

    The issue has now been resolved, as a fan who was kicked out of Yankee Stadium for daring to attempt to go to the restroom during God Bless America filed a Federal Court lawsuit against the Yankees.

    It was just settled, with the Yankees and the City of New York agreeing that they could not, and would no longer, prevent fans from leaving their seats during God Bless America, and by paying the plaintiff $10,000 in damages and $12,000 in legal fees. The story notes that the City of New York settled with the fan, due to him being physically removed from the stadium by two uniformed NYPD cops, one of whom who also said to him "Get out of my country.”

    The news report.
    Since June 10, 2012 a vegan aarf but still writing the Hound Dawg Sports Blog
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