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  1. #1
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    have you noticed a substantial change in google returns?

    a drop in relevancy?

    a new, inferior, algorithm?



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  2. #2
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    There has been a change, for sure, but the only place I've noticed it the results are more relevant not less.

    The results for regional real estate terms have been rubbish for a while now, but with this update they at least point to sites that offer real estate in the right county or state. Haven't had a chance to figure out why this is or what exactly has changed, but it is a change nonetheless. And a positive one.

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  3. #3
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    I am not so sure about improved relevancy.
    on the contrary.

    seems less importance is placed to *title* relevancy now. it somehow reminds me of how AltaVista started messing up their results with the ensuing dire (for them) consequences. it all started with degrading the importance of titles and giving almost no credit to title relevancy .


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  4. #4
    ABW Ambassador Andy's Avatar
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    I've noticed a lot of spammy sites popping up for the first time with this update. For one search term, which my site has sat at the #1 position for months, another site popped into the #1 position, bumping me to #2.

    So, I took a look at it. Not very impressive at all. Then I discovered the hidden text. Hundreds of keywords and keyphrases the same color as the background! A totally worthless page, getting #1 in the results due to spam.

    I reported them to Google. If they had taken the #1 spot fair and square, fine. I'd just have to re-optimize my page. But I'm not about to add hidden text in order to be competitive.

    I understand that Google is trying to index sites that were previously banned with this update, but they need to do a better job of ensuring those sites aren't still commiting the same infractions that got them banned in the first place.

    Andy

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  5. #5
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> seems less importance is placed to *title* relevancy now. it somehow reminds me of how AltaVista started messing up their results with the ensuing dire (for them) consequences. it all started with degrading the importance of titles and giving almost no credit to title relevancy . <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Well, there was a move to less importance placed on the title tag a few months back. Also the keyword order of the title tag seemed to make less difference. This is still largely in place. However, from the particular set of SERPs I am looking at, it seems to me that the title tag has been given more prominence not less.

    Maybe we should start a private topic on this as we are seeing totally contradictory indicators. At least then, we can look at specific examples and compare notes.

    Search Engine Positioning - 1 Design 4 Life

  6. #6
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    markymark and all:

    something VERY strange must have happened today at Google - eventually resulting to the black out reported elsewhere in this forum.

    most of our top listings appeared to be downgraded by a new algorithm (not very badly but badly enough) with what appeared to be a parallel downgrading of title importance.

    Yahoo was totally unaffected by this - they seemed to be running the usual algorithm.

    HOWEVER, at this moment the old algorithm seems to have been reinstated (temporarily?) and along with this *all* our top listings previously downgraded have actually been reinstated!

    all this within the span of 20 hours!

    in view of all these puzzling developments we better wait and see before drawing any reliable conclusions.


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  7. #7
    ABW Ambassador CrazyGuy's Avatar
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    Yep - I'm seeing that too.

    Several terms I use for testing were blitzed away with the new algo - now they're back in the same place as last month.

    I seem to recall this happening before in the recent past - new algo, caused a bit of uproar, was pulled back. There is some anecdotal evidence that the new expired domain filtering has cast a wider net than it was designed to, so they may have decided to fall back and proceed more cautiously.

    Or it may be a glitch and we'll get slammed again tomorrow

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  8. #8
    ABW Ambassador DesignerWiz's Avatar
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    I noted our service page PR deviating between PR6 - PR8 all day yesterday as well.

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  9. #9
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    at this moment:

    - www.google.com returns the old index
    - www2, www3, .co.uk, .de, .it, return the new index
    - yahoo seems to be returning a mix of the old and the new index !!!!

    good grief . . .


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  10. #10
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    Isn't that what happens every month until the dance is over...

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  11. #11
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    yes

  12. #12
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    This has nothing to do with "pulling back the algo" or something being wrong with Google. It's just the dance is not over yet, hasn't settled over to the main Google. Throughout the dance the new directory will bounce in and out of the main. Give it another day or 2.

    I don't care what my girlfriend says, i know i can dance, watch me go

  13. #13
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> it all started with degrading the importance of titles and giving almost no credit to title relevancy.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Sorry about that, it is because I put a great deal of effort last month into fixing titles on my site. The end result of making sure my titles matched the content dropped each of the pages about 10 slots. (Before the change the titles really didn't match content all that well).

  14. #14
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> it all started with degrading the importance of titles and giving almost no credit to title relevancy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Au contraire. Play around and you will find plenty of #1 listings for exact matches of title to search string.

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  15. #15
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    deelzebub, may be I have to clarify:

    the *majority* of top 10 titles match poorly the *exact* search term. some of them do not even contain the search term at all. they would match better the exact search term if more points were given by the algorithm to the title tag. previously this phenomenon although present was more rare. now it is more prevalent - and so I conclude that the importance of titles has been downgraded.

    these are nuances you must be careful of. not that you may gauge them with any accuracy or do very much about them. . . .


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  16. #16
    Outsourced Program Manager Chris -  AMWSO's Avatar
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    Oh yea, Google are doing an absolutely pitiful job of stopping Spam sites this month, I lost a number one slot for Mondera that I have held for ...years.... to a site using off page text.

    I've even seen a site using a JS redirect above the HTML headers get listed very high even though a user would never see the site content and would be sent direct to the other site... content is only visible to spiders and Java dead browsers

    Sad state of affairs....

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  17. #17
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    Chris, it's always a sad state of affairs when you lose a number one slot, but someone must be happy, hope it's me!

  18. #18
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    if all this is indeed due to the Dance, it is a different nuance of Dance from what we have been experiencing up to now.

    there *is* temporary trouble at google, witness the blackout, but only google know actually what kind of trouble. the two indexes still alternating (for what reason?) operate on two quite different algorithms - same pages, existing in both databases, are ranked in a different way.

    a Dance, no doubt, but not similar to what we have witnessed up to now, I believe.

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  19. #19
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    THE INDEXES HAVEN'T COMPLETELY SETTLED. Same dance as always, nothing is wrong.

    "the two indexes still alternating (for what reason?)"
    It's still dancing.

    "operate on two quite different algorithms - same pages, existing in both databases, are ranked in a different way"
    This is how it is all the time. Theres a change in the algo every month, usually just slightly. So every month usually you will go up and down, nothing out of the ordinary.

    I don't care what my girlfriend says, i know i can dance, watch me go

  20. #20
    Full Member heisje's Avatar
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    TrustNo1,

    all what you say is very correct, but beyond the point.

    there is a new index and a new algorithm (as seen in the test domains www2.google.com and www3.google.com)and the search results (which soon shall be universal) are not so relevant -in my opinion- as with the old index. the downgrading of title importance is also, in my opinion, a new fact, as many of the titles in top 10 positions do not even contain the search terms. this was not so extensive in the past as is observed in the new index, and has not happened for a long time now. this development, I expect, shall make a substatial difference to many pages' positioning - unlike in past Dances.



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  21. #21
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    When does the Google Boogie usually occur? I thought it was more towards the middle of the month...

    Either way, I've got the funk playing at full volume....



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