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  1. #1
    Outsourced Program Manager Jorge - SHOPiMAR's Avatar
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    Why are you getting rid of that affiliate.....It should be a joint effort
    When a merchant asks:

    Why are you getting rid of that affiliate when they are still approved by the network and also still works with and is promoting my competitor?

    As an OPM we may get this asked often and how do we answer the merchant and justify it as to why get rid of that affiliate while he is still partnered with a network and promotes the merchants competitors either on same network or another?

    I believe it should not be left alone only to the OPMs, Managers, Merchants and Networks as individuals be the ones separately responsible for controlling, outing or getting rid of unethical affiliates. It should be a joint effort to get rid of and or stop unethical affiliates altogether.

    The UA tag line above says "Affiliate Marketing's Self Regulation Initiative"

    It should be a concern to all affiliates to police and regulate as a group because then it would still be tightly controlled otherwise and some of those may still want to protect the bad players. If you have no say, control or voice you can't blame the OPMs, Managers, Merchants and Networks later as they will always win, but you will loose.

  2. #2
    The Seal of Aproval rematt's Avatar
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    It would seem to me that the main impetus is put on the merchants, OPMs and AMs with very little or no action taken by the networks to remove unethical affiliates. When several merchants remove an affiliate for cause (as seen in other threads) I would think that the network would take notice and remove the affiliate. I understand that this type of action wold remove the affiliate from programs that they may not be abusing, however just because a thief attends services on Sunday it doesn't absolve them of their crimes (at least not by mans law).

    As affiliates we also have a responsibility to fight for ethical behavior by our peers and I think that this forum is an excellent beginning. Unfortunately we can only apply peer pressure and have no enforcement capability so we can only "out" a bad player. But that's a beginning.

    I understand that the networks and some merchants make a lot of money by dealing with this type of affiliate, but they will never earn the trust of the larger, ethical affiliate community until they start doing the right thing and removing the bad players.

    "If you lay down with dogs....." (no offense assorted ABW Hounds)

    -rematt
    "I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." - Richard Nixon

  3. #3
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    Really merchants need to smarten up and I mean more the merchant than affiliate manager (if you're a good affiliate manager, not directed at you).

    "I would think that the network would take notice and remove the affiliate."

    Problem is they make money on all of this. Because the problem has always been, that networks were supposed to make the rules (along with merchants) and enforce them. But they lose money when they enforce their own rules. Black hat stuff, forced clicks, cookie stuffing, bho's, deceptive redirection, those are all network cookies getting on the user's computers. They buy something, network gets a cut. Sometimes they take action, I think it's more when the merchant raises a stink about it. Because there have been no shortage of examples thru the years with rules violations (and video on a lot of it) and nothing happens most of the time.

    So merchant or good affiliate manager. There are bad affiliate managers who have a lot these bad affiliates in because it simply pads their numbers. It makes it look like the affiliate channel is really bringing in the sales when all it does is just target the merchant domain, their employer. The good affiliate managers who really have their merchant's best interest at heart, do the right thing. But a lot of times we're talking to the wrong person when we should be contacting the people that hired them and let them know what their employee is getting them mixed into.

  4. #4
    Affiliate Manager Howard Gottlieb's Avatar
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    I agree completely. There is absolutely no incentive for a network to clean house. In fact they would lose revenue.

    If there is to be change in the industry it needs to be brought about by merchants understanding that they are paying commissions on many sales that were not generated by a legitimate click.

    I can not see why that is so difficult for merchants to understand.
    I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die
    to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there
    isn't and die to find out there is.

  5. #5
    The Seal of Aproval rematt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trust
    Problem is they make money on all of this. Because the problem has always been, that networks were supposed to make the rules (along with merchants) and enforce them. But they lose money when they enforce their own rules. Black hat stuff, forced clicks, cookie stuffing, bho's, deceptive redirection, those are all network cookies getting on the user's computers. They buy something, network gets a cut.
    In almost any other industry, this would be considered a clear conflict of interest. The network is the only entity in this equation that has a global view of an affiliates practices and their inaction hurts both the ethical affiliate and the merchant and at the same time allows them to profit from the unethical behavior.

    -rematt
    "I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." - Richard Nixon

  6. #6
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    Yep, it's why merchants need to wake up, a lot of them get their info on what do to from networks. That's why "Trusted Third Party" has become a joke in many cases. Affiliate marketing existed before networks. Merchants and affiliates were the 1 -2 party and networks came along to join the party, which made them the third party. And there were some problems with merchants not paying affiliates or whatever, same type of problems today and this was the networks selling point. Awhile back someone even posted Todd's post about CJ when it was first starting out on some Yahoo group that the network would help in a lot of this. And they do help out in many ways and are convenient. But they don't always have the merchant's best interests at heart. I would never let them run my program as some merchants do. And we talk about response time from networks but the quickest I've seen is when a merchant drops a parasite, someone from a network will contact them quick. They know that adware and bho's and all that stuff can get a lot of network cookies on shopper's computers. So merchants really need to get with it. Some are slowing coming around.

  7. #7
    The Seal of Aproval rematt's Avatar
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    That's why "Trusted Third Party" has become a joke in many cases.
    Yeah, I like that one.

    -rematt
    "I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." - Richard Nixon

  8. #8
    ABW Veteran Mr. Sal's Avatar
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    I understand that this type of action wold remove the affiliate from programs that they may not be abusing, however just because a thief attends services on Sunday it doesn't absolve them of their crimes (at least not by mans law).
    But as usually, there are those that faithfully will forgive them, again and again!

    Because:

  9. #9
    The Seal of Aproval rematt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Sal
    But as usually, there are those that faithfully will forgive them, again and again!

    Because:
    Makes you wonder who the real thieves are.

    -rematt
    "I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant." - Richard Nixon

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